god damn cheaters!

[JuniorG]

i was playing a great game with some guys online (europe - titan - block 3)

we were doing great and had great team spirit when suddenly i died! my SOUL EATER + 35 was then stolen by a spanish guy named CHACO so look out for him.

me and the rest of the team were questinoing and pleading with him for 10 mins and he just laughed.

when your only level 23 a weapon like that (475 ATP) means a lot!

its only thanks to a force character (forget his name!) that i got another excellent weapon.

this thieving crack is really winding me up!

[Prodigy]

Geez...I know how you feel. Do you even know some ppl consider stealing to not be cheating? Hmm...where is the logic in that?
Thankfully, not everyone is bad out there. There are actually some pretty decent ppl who know better than to ruin their rep just so they can take the easy way and not have to find the item themselves.
Note to self: If ever you play with ppl that you don't know/don't seem to trust, put on your most crappiest weapon-no joke! That'll let them know, you don't have anythin worth taking. If you don't wanna do that, just take care of yourself.
I have such a problem with thieves. Why can't they find items themself? Sadly to say, theives can't be avoided, but looking out for yourself can.
Be careful in the future. I don't want to begin telling my stories of me being ripped off.
I need an asprin...
=P

[Eowyn]

Thats the problem with PSO, your reputation hardly matters at all. Even if you ruin your reputation, you can always make another character. Thats why on other games (Everquest) people are usually nicer. Because it takes forever to level up and if you're a bad person then noone will talk/trade/help/etc you. And it's really hard to start a new char.

Of course, this is only PSO 1 and we can only assume it'll get better in the future. Most new games always had flaws. Thats how games evolve, release, patch, release, patch...etc. Oh well. We can only wait for PSO 2

[Socrates]

"Do you even know some ppl consider stealing to not be cheating? Hmm...where is the logic in that?"

Where is the logic in your statement? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/icon_smile.gif

While I'm as rabidly anti-cheating as the next guy, I don't think a guy who steals from a dead comrade is cheating. Horribly rude, and right true arseholw, but not cheating.

Sega deliberately put in the game the fact that when you die, you drop your weapon and money. This is what's known as an incentive. An incentive not to get in over your head, because there is the possibility that if you do, you may lose something. As other people have noted, the term 'steal' is in the word-choice selection, so I suspect Sega knew it would happen in multiplayer as well. Again, more incentive for a person to go screaming willy-nilly into an area that he is grossly underdeveloped for.

Stealing is rude, reprehensible and suitable for only the lowest dregs of the online society. But is it "cheating"? I don't think so. If something is designed into the game, I cannot see how you could call it "cheating".

[Prodigy]

Steal/verb:
1.to take and carry away without right or permission
2.to come or go secretly or gradually
Cheat(ing)/verb:
1.to deprive of something through fraud or deceit
2.to practice fraud or trickery
3.to violate rules dishonestly

Perhaps I had no logic when I made my question, but I still stand by it. Yes, Sega did make it so when you die, you drop your weapons and money. However, I don't believe that their purpose for doing that was so someone could take it away.
There is a visible relationship between stealing and cheating. Let's see...
You're fighting against some Boomas in Vhard mode with a group of people you are unfamiliar with. You die, which there is nothing wrong with, and you lie there, hoping that some kind person will revive you. Instead, a weapon that you treasured lies out in the opening for the taking. Just like that...gone.
What is my point you ask? My point is that by taking a weapon which obviously isn't yours, you are stealing. By stealing, you are making your trip down PSO lane easier. By no means am I degrading you as a person-I respect your decisions. I just strongly believe that it is wrong. To have a weapon/money be taken away is terrible! I don't know if you've ever experienced that, but it's terrible. To find my own weapon and to have it taken away is not my idea of great. And, I don't exactly have a spare in my bank which makes it worse.
Please understand that I do not think of you any lesser than anyone I talk to.
Geez...didn't mean to make it a long post. This is strictly my opinion.

[Neojin]

Very nice Prodigy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/icon_smile.gif

Although I myself do see the differnce between Cheating (hacking, duping) and stealing (just looting someones stuff)

In definition they are very similar, in both cases you are aquiring somthing by means which you did not honestly earn. The phrase "Lie, cheat, and steal" is usualy always together.

I think without your little comment
"Where is the logic in your statement?" you would of had a better argument.

But with that little jab you came off like you were saying, "Your dumb" to her. Just somthing to think about. Like she said it was her opinion, we are entitled to an opinion once and awhile without other belittling it are we not?

[Prodigy]

Thank you very much Neojin! Your encouragement means a lot to me.
I didn't mean to offend anyone by my opinion. I was just hoping that maybe I could convince some ppl how wrong it is. I have no power over what everyone decides what to believe, but I can provide an impact on the community.
Perhaps PSO 2 can help change these methods...

[Prodigy]

Thank you very much Neojin! Your encouragement means a lot to me.
I didn't mean to offend anyone by my opinion. I was just hoping that maybe I could convince some ppl how wrong it is. I have no power over what everyone decides what to believe, but I can provide an impact on the community.
Perhaps PSO 2 can help change these methods...

[Holy_Knight]

I am Holy Knight. I do not go online often so you've probably never heard of me before. All i have to say is that there are thieves everywhere. Whether it be a game or real life, where there's stuff to steal, there's theives. Noone can stop this. In a way it's a good thing because it teaches us to be more cautious. On the few times i went online, i took a few simple precautions that safegaurded me from several disasters (BSoDs, Theives, etc., etc.). Before i went online i did the following: 1)got to level 20+. i wasnt aware whether you could be PKed in this game so i got stronger before coming online. 2)Keep backup equip. I dont have a separate phone line to go online so i get some backup equip (currently a Fill Gladius, 3 slot King's Frame, some crappier versions of the units i normally use, a general shield and my backup LVL 70+ MAG). This is so that if i'm PKed or disconnected i dont really get hurt that much. 3) Bring lots of recovery items. There's no oppurtunity for theft if i dont die.
4) Start making some friends before you trade. It's somewhat unlikely, but still possible that a conartist/theif might have messed with one of your friends too. Also you can meet their friends and start some sort of click so you dont have to trade neone else (i just dont trade that much period). Well i hope this helped

[Socrates]

Well, my apologies if it came out sounding rude; t'was not my intent. After all, I did put the smiley in there. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/icon_smile.gif

That phrase was an attempt, in good humor, to turn her statement around on her... she said that stealing is the same as cheating, and those who did not see that were obviously not being logical. I turned it around, and said that her statement that they are the same itself may well be just as illogical.

I see cheating as doing something that is outside the design of the game.

Thus, using a gameshark to dupe or enhance an item is cheating. The ability to steal downed member's weapons and money are not only possible according to the design of the game, but are in fact assumed to be a possible occurence even by the game designers.

So I personally can't see how someone can say it's cheating.

Unethical, rude, corrupt, cowardly, pathetic, selfish, antisocial... sure, any of those I feel adequately describes stealing.

But to call it cheating? No more so than buying a weapon from the store or using a monomate to heal your health. The ability to take someone's weapon when they die was designed into the game from the get-go, so I don't consider it cheating.

[Prodigy]

Again, I apologize for my unlogical statement. I didn't mean to sound as if the statement was illogical. I just didn't understand how stealing could not be cheating.
Yes, Sega made it so that when you die, you lose your weapon and your money. But was the purpose for doing such was so that someone else could claim your weapon and your money? Honestly, I think that not to be the case. I believe that they made it this way so you'll be more cautious when you're about to die-you'll have to retrieve your weapon and money, no doubt. I truly believe that this "die and you lose ur wep" thing is so that you'll be careful NOT to die, so that you'll be more cautious and aware of what you're doing.
I still stand by my opinion that stealing is cheating. I do see you point though, Socrates. I respect you for that.
Yes, stealing and cheating are two different things on its own, but if you take a weapon that isn't yours, you're stealing. By stealing, you're making your life easier so you won't have to find/trade that weapon on your own, thus, it's cheating.
Geez...I need to stop being so formal. =P Anyway, you're right Holy Knight. Theives are everywhere-sadly to say. Can the world change such a bad problem? Prolly not. *Sigh*

[Sai-Yuk]

I'm getting sick of all the people stealing from players who do all the hard work to get the weapons, I've also had a look at the PK thing (i'll never be able to do it - never met anything that drops the items in over 100 hours of game play with my old char) people using that to steals bad but... What if some people actually used it to kill theives and stuff? would that be a bad thing?
A vengence type kill to try and get back your stuff would be at least some insurance but saying that, whats to stop the person from killing others to get their stuff... The only way i can really think of saving your weapons and money is to have a friend who you trust go with you and when either of you die the other grabs their stuff for safe keeping
Then again, someone's gonna mention that the other person could just steal your stuff and...
Hmm... Ok... forget that, just get your hands on a spare weapon to use online when you think you're gonna die...
Ok... i give up... I'm getting nowhere...