Fate...

[Nazo]

Before I go into this, please note the following:

1) I'm doing this out of SHEER BOREDOM. This is not done under any emotional, physical, mental, or any other manner of benefit or disbenefit. Please have fun and tell what you think.

2) Please try to stay away from religious matters. I love people who are religious, and I love people who are not religious. But its far too dainty, and therefore I wish to avoid it.

Thanks. Now that I go to this, some might already have thought of the key word which brought me to discuss this topic: "The Matrix". Well, ok, that's two words. But anyways, I was thinking about it a lot, and some quotes in teh movie inspired me to think about it.

Agent Smith: "You hear that, Mr. Anderson? That is the sound of inevitability. It is the sound....of your death."

Well, I think its self-explanatory. The part where Neo is bound to the chair, Agent Smith already thinks that it will happen.

The key-maker says:: "I know because I must know. It's my purpose. It's the reason I'm here. Same reason we're all here."

And as Agent Smith says, "We're not here because we're free, we're here because we're not free." He mentions this as a reference to fate.

But as Morpheus says, "No, What happened happened and couldnt have happened any other way."



So what really is fate? Can it be changed? And as Neo points out, "[he] doesn't accept the idea of fate, because [he] doesn't like the idea of not being able to change the way [he] acts." But then again, is this whole idea real? As Morpheus says, "What is real? How do you define real?"


Some food for thought.

[BlueJammer]

I hate to sound cheap and cheesy, but fate is as real as the person who believes in it.

[martian_man]

i hate 2 sound cheesy but it feels good o.O.....you shape ur own fate lol

[Abaddon]

Fate, like love, is a psychological device that some people beleive in and others don't. But whether it holds some phsyical property cannot be proven because it cannot be measured or counted. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Sagasu]

Fate is a simple way to explain why something has happened. "It was bound by fate" "It was your fate/destiny/"

It all really depends on the way you think and believe/as far as your religion inflects what you believe.

[Cerris]

if some1 says i die tonight, whats stopping their finger from pulling the trigger?

[BogusKun]

On 2003-10-27 05:15, Cerris wrote:
if some1 says i die tonight, whats stopping their finger from pulling the trigger?




Fighting back...
Running...
It's up to you.
The decisions are already made once you were born Neo... I mean...

Cerris, sorry. heh.

[Xiu_Hazuki]

I go with, fate only takes you a certain length down the trail. Its up to you which path to choose after that.

[Mystil]

Fate isn't a path nor a decision. It's a dark void that you sink under when you succumb to failure...

[Scejntjynahl]

Hmmm...fate..oh okay how about this then:

A monk had two pupils, on one fine day he led his pupils to a road that split into two directions. He asked his pupils to choose a road. The pupils were perplexed, but each took a different road from each other. Ten years passed...and at the end of both roads met at a same point again. Both pupils arrived at the same place?!? And there was the monk, waiting. And he said to them "It is not the path that matters to destiny, it is when you arrive that destiny is fullfilled" or something like that. Don't shoot me ok, this was told to me when I was six. I guess fate is just the end results of our actions, a way to define our actions when we ourselves cannot find an explanation about the path we are in. Imho of course.

[Kent]

The only thing pre-determined by fate is the fact that we'll eventually perish. Anything else is up in the air until it happens.

[starhealer]

Fate is our ultimate end. You can't change fate. As Kent said, our only "true" fate is to die. Destiny, on the other hand, is of our making. We can pick and choose our destiny. It's like the monks' road posted above. Destiny is a choice, a difference in paths that will inevitably lead us to our ultimate fate.

If I am "fated" to great things, then that will happen regardless of the path I choose. I'll always eventually get there. If I'm "destined" for great things, that's simply the path I've chosen on my way to my ultimate fate. *shrugs* It's a little hazy because the distinction between the two words has been lost--or just about, at least.

Or we could all just be Greek and call them gods (well, okay, Destiny as a goddess). Woooo!

[NKOTB]

All things are possible through God.

[MasterJoel]

i would say that fate exists... this free will everyone is talking about, is a fascade. our "free will" is actually what is fated to happen. that doesn't mean you aren't responsible for your actions...

[ABDUR101]

I don't see fate as a form of control.

Think of it like this. Nobody knows their fate, whether you think you do or not, you don't.

So there are dots all over the line known as your life, these are points of fate. Every dot has a fated event, action, or situation.(In effect, a line is made up of dots. So every instance could be considered to be part of fate.)

Just because something is fated doesn't mean you're not living your life. You're still making the decisions, fate is just the decisions in the future that you haven't made yet.

[Guile]

I don't see finding many answers about a topic such as fate from a movie.

[Kadou]

I'm not much of a fatalist myself. Some things I know are inevitable, such as death, but for the most part I don't think it's at all possible for anything in the future to be preordained by some higher force or consciousness.

[HUnewearl_Meira]

Fate is an interesting topic. It's something that I've personally given a lot of thought. I believe that MasterJoel and Abdur touched on it. Here's my point of view on the subject.

Each of us has our own free will, to make decisions and go by them. We are not forced by some outside force to do something, though our actions are sufficiently predictable given that we must all conform to the behavior patterns that have been carved out by our personalities; our personalities having been fashioned from the compiled matrix of our past experiences, and the mixing of those experiences together in the sequence they occured in.

So, effectively, we have choices, which will be made by us, to some degree of predictability. Those choices are ours and no one elses. Will you choose the can of Coca-Cola, or the can of Pepsi-Cola? Will you go to the movies to see the new Lord of the Rings film, or will you go and see your grandmother instead? Maybe you'll stay home and play PSO?
These are all choices that any one of us may happen to make, and these choices will be made by us, according to our own established behavioral pattern, each of us having a unique behavior all to ourselves. That is inescapable-- Everything you choose is ultimately the result of your own behavior, influenced only by what is on your mind at the time of the decision. After reading this far, you may be prone to saying that you'll bust out of your behavior pattern, and do something different. That's not possible, however. Having read what I've written here thus far, the attempt to break away from your behavior will only be the result of your behavior reacting to what you've read. Point is moot.
The question of behavior is unimportant, however. Here's what's important:
Every decision you make, you will only make once. You may have opportunity to make a similar decision at a later date, but that doesn't change the fact that, for the sake of argument, on June 3rd, 1998, you chose the pepperoni pizza over the ham sandwich. You will never be able to go back and change that. Ever. It simply won't happen. The choice is made, and the deed is done. You can't go back and fix it, if the pepperoni pizza made you sick, and your date that night never wants to see you again because of it.
So what it all means is that Fate is not a counter-agent of free will. Free will means that you will make your own decisions. The fact that you have a Fate means that you WILL make the decisions that you are going to make, and you can never escape that. The future cannot change any more than the past can. Does this mean that the future is predetermined? Not exactly. It means that the future will be what it will be. What the future will be is determined by your own useage of your own free will, but what you choose will be the choice you make. No matter what.

My philosophy dictates that I will do those things that I will do. I will not try to fight against my behavior, and I will not try to be someone else. I will serve the purpose that my behavior ultimately serves, without question. If I turn out to be the next famous saint for my good deeds, then I will do that. If I turn out to be the Anti-Christ, then I will do that too, as it would be the purpose that my behavior serves. If my behavior leads me to my own destruction, then so be it. If my behavior leads me to immortality, then so be it. I will do what I will do, and I will make the choices that I will make. I have no other choices to turn to.
So, effectively, if I gain the world's praise for my deeds, then that's good. There's nothing wrong with that. If I end up releasing a lethal mutant strain of Anthrax on a vital hub of sport cow-tipping during the sporting season, then I will do that, and pay my dues for the crime I'd be commiting. While there might be something inherently wrong with the decision to do such a task, it would be the decision I'd be making, and I'd be subject to the results, the results being the product of another's useage of their own free will.

So, the conclusion?
Fate is inescapable. You will use your Free Will only in the ways that you will use it. Is Fate a mystical thing? Nope. Purely logical. Time only happens once. Only once, will 12:30:00.00pm PST 6-13-05 occur, and only once will you experience it.