Should the internet be policed? [Archive]

Nazo

Jul 17, 2004, 10:23 AM

And then a rebellion will break out worldwide to escape invasion of privacy. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

Look at the Matrix, Enemy of the State... even I, Robot or Issac Asimov's novels. Tom Clancy's state technology novels. All say "NO." Why?

A) Its against the law explicitly to do this. Over 5 clauses of the original constitution and a few amendments say, "You can't peek there!"

B) Everyone would hate it.

C) There are technically some of these already within small communities (e.g. schools, dorms, colleges, institutions, detention centers, etc.) Of course we can't prevent every evil in the world, or we'd be in heaven already. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif But good efforts are being made to put security on tight in the most compulsory places.

Now if only Bush will be stupid enough not to sign the Security act being proposed in the Senate...

astuarlen

Jul 17, 2004, 11:15 AM

Hell no. If parents think the internet is too dangerous for their little brats, that's their responsability to deal with it.
And how exactly would one go about "policing" the internet? Who could do this? What would they be looking for?

[ This Message was edited by: astuarlen on 2004-07-17 09:37 ]

AUTO_

Jul 17, 2004, 12:05 PM

Someone should wipe out those websites that are just videoclips of death; whether they're real or not.

That shit doesn't benefit anyone...and I have to wonder what kind of mental-state the people who created those sites are in...as well as the people who go there to watch that shit.

Oh yeah...

and they should get rid of porn completely http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

*runs*

Sagasu

Jul 17, 2004, 12:12 PM

No, not in any form or fashion, there are more ways to make a system work than to 'enforce' the 'rules'

Thats all I have to say.

[ This Message was edited by: Sarunakai on 2004-07-17 10:14 ]

Dangerous55

Jul 17, 2004, 12:16 PM

Spyware and virus stuff should be illegal, any crap like that.

Maybe there should be something where people police it themselves and can report things on a website.

Para

Jul 17, 2004, 12:26 PM

On 2004-07-17 10:16, Dangerous55 wrote:
Spyware and virus stuff should be illegal, any crap like that.

Maybe there should be something where people police it themselves and can report things on a website.

that and ad ware... ad ware should be allowed to be reported to the police and track its owners down.

Firocket1690

Jul 17, 2004, 12:48 PM

meh

no internet law enforcement. >=o

People have their own servers, they do whatever they like with it.

Oh, and the day we get some internet law enforcement, the world will be itentical to Battle Network http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif
.. or something like that

P.S. lesse here ... You've brought this up at your own board.
You've brought it up here.
You've brought it up here again.
......
Why ? =/

[ This Message was edited by: Firocket1690 on 2004-07-17 10:50 ]

Eanae

Jul 17, 2004, 01:08 PM

First, a bit of off topic story:
Internet security is a big deal in my school system. We used to be able to access IM programs, but all of that got ruined this year by some fuck-heads who abused this...

There was a group of middle school girls who were using the IM programs to initiate "sexual" conversations with people over the internet. These girls were stupider than stupid. They gave these guys their real names, addresses, and phone numbers! Talk about stupid! They even were recieving sexual pictures of these guys... One day, one of the mothers found this picture in her daughters backpack. Then the school decided to but the block on IM programs. I used those all the time with no damn trouble what so ever. Even completed some school projects using them! But no... one person has to go ruin it for everyone...

Now, back on topic. I believe everyone should have the right to do what they wish with the internet. It's one of the freedoms of Americans, and though I'm not familliar with the laws of other countries I'm pretty sure it's one of their rights as well. Taking that right away is taking the basic rights of freedom. Computers are the basis of life now a days. Alot of peoples lives revolve around them. Take away their freedom with computers, you leave them with nothing.

Sagasu

Jul 17, 2004, 01:33 PM

On 2004-07-17 11:08, Eanae wrote:
It's one of the freedoms of Americans, and though I'm not familliar with the laws of other countries I'm pretty sure it's one of their rights as well.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_disapprove.gif

Firocket1690

Jul 17, 2004, 01:43 PM

On 2004-07-17 11:33, Sarunakai wrote:

On 2004-07-17 11:08, Eanae wrote:
It's one of the freedoms of Americans, and though I'm not familliar with the laws of other countries I'm pretty sure it's one of their rights as well.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_disapprove.gif

Bill of Rights (http://www.house.gov/Constitution/Amend.html)
It's an American thing.

Ness

Jul 17, 2004, 02:12 PM

Ias for me, I think the internet should remain the "wild wild west" because no one owns it and when you start saying what can and can't be said on the internet, you get into infringing on people's freedoms.

Also if you don't want your children to look up something harmful, don't let them use it at all. Atlernatively, you can surf the internet with your children.

DarthFomar

Jul 17, 2004, 02:45 PM

On 2004-07-17 07:08, Ness wrote:
Since our last few debate topics went pretty well, I decided to create another one.

Some people out there think that the internet should remain the "wild wild west," but others think it should be policed because it can be a dangerous place. What is your opinion on this issue?

I think the Internet should be "maintained", not policed.

In my eyes, the monitoring and punishing of fraud and other junk is just a tad weak, at this point in time.

They could do something to toughen up the stability and professionalism of the internet, though. I guess if push comes to shove they should police the thing.

But, all that is really needed is a more strict punishment for white collar crimes and quicker executive responses.

Here's an example: I got ripped off by a website called *ahem* Anime C@5t!e. I informed the BBB about it. And they go about saying that they can't do anything, when I even had the order form and everything.

Stuff like that should be monitored and controlled by an authority-like figure/company. The BBB can't always back you up, which was my case.

Policing the web wouldn't be a bad thing.....unless the power was abused. That's probably why I don't like it referred to as "policing". http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

Anyway......it doesn't really matter. They can do what they want. Really won't affect me unless I want to buy something, and get ripped off again. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[ This Message was edited by: DarthFomar on 2004-07-17 13:19 ]

KaFKa

Jul 17, 2004, 02:49 PM

its impossible to "police" the internet. simple as that

DarthFomar

Jul 17, 2004, 03:23 PM

On 2004-07-17 12:49, KaFKa wrote:
its impossible to "police" the internet. simple as that

Nothing is impossible. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

But, most things are. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

Weird how that works, isn't it?!

[ This Message was edited by: DarthFomar on 2004-07-17 13:23 ]

Subliminalgroove

Jul 17, 2004, 04:08 PM

It shouldn't be policed. Fact is, the minute you start applying blanket rules to the internet as a whole, you kill the very nature of what it has become. It is a souce of absolute free expression. You can say things online with NO "real" consequences of any kind.

While fraud is rife, I would like to point out that it is in the real world as well. Also, sometimes the BBB cannot support you in the real world either.

As far as concerned parents... why not do some acctual parenting. It seems these days, Parenting involves placing your child infront of a TV, VG console, or internet and getting on with YOUR life. That is not the case. You want to shelter your child from violence, sex, or language then you need to play an ACTIVE role in thier lives. You need to watch the shows they watch, you need to play (or atleast read about) the games they play, and you need to see what websites they go to (or use netnanny or something, though that blocks out many educational sites due to "sexual terms" (ie. breast, vagina, penis, etc).

Guile

Jul 17, 2004, 04:12 PM

It's far too huge to police, and it would just be stupid too.

Aredhel

Jul 17, 2004, 07:14 PM

The Internet is already policed - No disclaiming "" quote marks about it. Police get on the internet and lure sexual predators by pretending to be a young teenager and then arrest them at the scene because the men are not allowed to like 13-year olds *coughentrapmentcough*

It's quite true that many children are hurt and even killed by the sick fuckers who lure them into having sex with them and whatnot, but the police have taken it upon themselves to wage war against the citizens of America - going so far as to puppet the perverted albeit God-given sexual frustrations of a populace blinded by media which accentuates the values of youth and beauty. I am by no means defending child predators, they deserve to burn for their actions - but how far does it have to go to allegedly 'prevent' any incidents from occuring? Stay off my Internet you fucking Government sheep - lawn's already fertilized.

*hides in his bunker in Iowa* http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

Subliminalgroove

Jul 17, 2004, 07:27 PM

That's not so much policing the internet as using it as a tool to catch these sick people.

Aredhel

Jul 17, 2004, 07:38 PM

Ya, and roads are just the Government using a tool to catch those sick people who speed.

Subliminalgroove

Jul 17, 2004, 07:42 PM

Policed denotes a set of rules being dictated and enforced. This is the case in the real world, so catching and ticketing someone speeding on the highway is acceptable. There are no such laws laid down for the internet. Your example only works when those people go to met the fake girl. If the sicko keeps his perversion on the internet and never attempts to meet the fake kid in the real world... the cops can't really do anything about it.

[ This Message was edited by: Subliminalgroove on 2004-07-17 17:43 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Subliminalgroove on 2004-07-17 17:44 ]

Myopathy

Jul 17, 2004, 07:58 PM

Policing the internet is a near-impossible task. They won't try very hard because they know they can't. Look at the RIAA running around trying to police P2P sharing. They get lucky here and there, but their success ratio is embarassingly small.

[ This Message was edited by: Ezellaur on 2004-07-17 17:59 ]

Jason

Jul 17, 2004, 11:03 PM

This topic name is a laugh. But it did make me think for a minute.

Nazo

Jul 18, 2004, 07:32 AM

On 2004-07-17 21:03, Jason wrote:
This topic name is a laugh. But it did make me think for a minute.

-_-..;;;

KaFKa

Jul 18, 2004, 08:14 AM

On 2004-07-17 21:03, Jason wrote:
This topic name is a laugh. But it did make me think for a minute.

why arent you banned yet?

Jason

Jul 18, 2004, 07:57 PM

On 2004-07-18 06:14, KaFKa wrote:

On 2004-07-17 21:03, Jason wrote:
This topic name is a laugh. But it did make me think for a minute.

why arent you banned yet?

Heh. Sometimes I do think I will be banned. But really, I am a good guy who gets into mischief.

EDIT: Let's not screw up this topic about me. Thank you for my 1200th post.

[ This Message was edited by: Jason on 2004-07-18 17:59 ]

Ness

Jul 18, 2004, 08:36 PM

On 2004-07-18 17:57, Jason wrote:

On 2004-07-18 06:14, KaFKa wrote:

On 2004-07-17 21:03, Jason wrote:
This topic name is a laugh. But it did make me think for a minute.

why arent you banned yet?

Heh. Sometimes I do think I will be banned. But really, I am a good guy who gets into mischief.

EDIT: Let's not screw up this topic about me. Thank you for my 1200th post.

[ This Message was edited by: Jason on 2004-07-18 17:59 ]

You could make a post that actually contributes to the topic. That would keep you from being banned.

Jason

Jul 18, 2004, 09:12 PM

On 2004-07-18 18:36, Ness wrote:

On 2004-07-18 17:57, Jason wrote:

On 2004-07-18 06:14, KaFKa wrote:

On 2004-07-17 21:03, Jason wrote:
This topic name is a laugh. But it did make me think for a minute.

why arent you banned yet?

Heh. Sometimes I do think I will be banned. But really, I am a good guy who gets into mischief.

EDIT: Let's not screw up this topic about me. Thank you for my 1200th post.

[ This Message was edited by: Jason on 2004-07-18 17:59 ]

You could make a post that actually contributes to the topic. That would keep you from being banned.

Indeed it would. But I'm not clever enough to, not on this topic. So I shouldn't have posted here at all.

SpikeOtacon

Jul 18, 2004, 09:48 PM

I give you, ladies and gentlemen, the internet police.
http://img14.photobucket.com/albums/v43/KamakaziSpike/riaaswat.jpg

Now that we're beyond that, I'd like to point out that it is impossible to 'police' the internet. The RIAA's gotta get used to the fact that Music downloading isn't gonna die. Anti File Sharing people need to wake up and realize that it's never going to end. No matter what you do to 'prevent' the transfer of said data, someone will hack it and then it was practically worthless. There is a law that states "If someone makes it, someone can bend or break it." This is not exempt from the digital realm. 'Policing' the internet isn't possible because of this. Take Microsoft's new OS, 'Longhorn'. It's made to deny access to hacked files unless it is digitally signed by companies. This is a waste of money and time. Because someone is going to hack it and soon it's going to be all over the place.

I'm sure everyone's heard of the one bill that was trying to be passed that would place a chip into everyone's computers that would delete illigal material, and if the RIAA caught them downloading it, The computer would actually blow up (sortof). This goes against most of America's constitutional laws. However, we must all remember that the internet is everywhere. And since everyone does things differently, it would be nigh-impossible to make universal rules. Unless we broke the internet access to only that county, which would kill what the technology was designed for.

In closing, The only 'police' we'll be getting on the internet are those people playing anti-terrorists in counter-strike.

[ This Message was edited by: SpikeOtacon on 2004-07-18 19:49 ]

KodiaX987

Jul 18, 2004, 10:40 PM

I don't think policing the Internet will make it more secure, but I do believe we should limit access to it.

Just n00bs. Just those idiots are enough to degrade the Internet as a whole. People who don't know what they are doing, don't know jack about computers, and need to have you repeat over and over again the instructions you gave them. People who don't want to figure out the manual. People who don't want to type correctly. People who spam, people who basically are idiots.

Create licenses, ratings, I dunno, but for fuck's sake, find a way to make it so that the people who do get on the net know what they're doing!!

Mixfortune

Jul 18, 2004, 10:52 PM

On 2004-07-18 20:40, KodiaX987 wrote:
I don't think policing the Internet will make it more secure, but I do believe we should limit access to it.

Just n00bs. Just those idiots are enough to degrade the Internet as a whole. People who don't know what they are doing, don't know jack about computers, and need to have you repeat over and over again the instructions you gave them. People who don't want to figure out the manual. People who don't want to type correctly. People who spam, people who basically are idiots.

Create licenses, ratings, I dunno, but for fuck's sake, find a way to make it so that the people who do get on the net know what they're doing!!

Internet licenses... akin to driver's licenses?
Not a bad idea at all... get tested on proper internet manners and required skills before going out and doing what you need to do. In a better world, perhaps...

Nazo

Jul 19, 2004, 03:58 AM

On 2004-07-18 19:48, SpikeOtacon wrote:
I give you, ladies and gentlemen, the internet police.
http://img14.photobucket.com/albums/v43/KamakaziSpike/riaaswat.jpg

http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif My goodness, that's hilarious.

Spike's right. There's no way out. It would take... it would take...

hackers... ! yeah! Hackers! Not just two, but a whole organization- no! A whole continent! A whole CONTINENT OF HACKERS! A POPULATION OF HACKERS FOR JUSTICE! And ... and! They'll be living in Atlantis.. .and...

*knocks out from wine*

Moral: No.

Swan

Jul 19, 2004, 09:53 AM

unregulated it should remain! I shall say no more.

Aredhel

Jul 19, 2004, 10:07 AM

On 2004-07-17 17:42, Subliminalgroove wrote:
Policed denotes a set of rules being dictated and enforced. This is the case in the real world, so catching and ticketing someone speeding on the highway is acceptable. There are no such laws laid down for the internet. Your example only works when those people go to met the fake girl. If the sicko keeps his perversion on the internet and never attempts to meet the fake kid in the real world... the cops can't really do anything about it.

[ This Message was edited by: Subliminalgroove on 2004-07-17 17:43 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Subliminalgroove on 2004-07-17 17:44 ]

This all, of course, depends on your view of what 'policing' means...

Ever hear of soliciting a minor online? They can find you and they can put you in prison for it - police just prefer to lure people out to a park or a mall or something so that they don't have to get a warrant to enter your house with a swat team http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

wake up

Myopathy

Jul 19, 2004, 10:16 AM

On 2004-07-19 08:07, Aredhel wrote:

On 2004-07-17 17:42, Subliminalgroove wrote:
Policed denotes a set of rules being dictated and enforced. This is the case in the real world, so catching and ticketing someone speeding on the highway is acceptable. There are no such laws laid down for the internet. Your example only works when those people go to met the fake girl. If the sicko keeps his perversion on the internet and never attempts to meet the fake kid in the real world... the cops can't really do anything about it.

[ This Message was edited by: Subliminalgroove on 2004-07-17 17:43 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Subliminalgroove on 2004-07-17 17:44 ]

This all, of course, depends on your view of what 'policing' means...

Ever hear of soliciting a minor online? They can find you and they can put you in prison for it - police just prefer to lure people out to a park or a mall or something so that they don't have to get a warrant to enter your house with a swat team http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

wake up

Actually, no, they can't. All evidence online is circumstantial and would never hold up in court. Sure they could go get a warrant, but they would be wasting their time since they would have nothing to prosecute the person on. Online, you never know who you're talking to. The person could easily tell the cops he didn't really believe the person was underrage and just assumed they were of age, and the police would have nothing to prove him otherwise. The only way the police can arrest a person for that is if they meet in the real world and the person then solicites the minor.

Firocket1690

Jul 19, 2004, 02:29 PM

On 2004-07-19 08:07, Aredhel wrote:
Ever hear of soliciting a minor online? They can find you and they can put you in prison for it - police just prefer to lure people out to a park or a mall or something so that they don't have to get a warrant to enter your house with a swat team http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

I thought the police also goes off to lure kids to meet them someplace. IRL at meeting place, the officer warns said child to be m ore careful online.

Subliminalgroove

Jul 19, 2004, 03:59 PM

Aredhel

Jul 19, 2004, 04:51 PM

On 2004-07-19 08:16, Ezellaur wrote:

Actually, no, they can't. All evidence online is circumstantial and would never hold up in court. Sure they could go get a warrant, but they would be wasting their time since they would have nothing to prosecute the person on. Online, you never know who you're talking to. The person could easily tell the cops he didn't really believe the person was underrage and just assumed they were of age, and the police would have nothing to prove him otherwise. The only way the police can arrest a person for that is if they meet in the real world and the person then solicites the minor.

OK, so maybe they won't actually enter your house with a swat team to arrest you ( I was exaggerating) but if you are caught by police at the designated meeting place, it is my understanding that you are promptly placed in cuffs and hauled off for what you didn't do. Of course, I am no expert on this subject, I'm just relaying what was told to us by an Internet Police Officer who came to visit our Info. Processing class. And some of you seem to know an awful lot about this subject...

Like em' young, huh?

*dons flame-retardant suit*

Eihwaz

Jul 19, 2004, 05:02 PM

On 2004-07-19 01:58, Nazo wrote:
hackers... ! yeah! Hackers! Not just two, but a whole organization- no! A whole continent! A whole CONTINENT OF HACKERS! A POPULATION OF HACKERS FOR JUSTICE! And ... and! They'll be living in Atlantis.. .and...

THANK YOU: EVERY HACKERS OF PSO. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

The internet really can't be policied, but some things on it are just sick. Kids should have a really hard time getting to the sick and freaky stuff. O_o;

And the RIAA can try their damndest to stop movie/MP3 downloading, but I'll doubt they'll succeed, ever.

Hell, I get virtually all my songs in AIM file transfers from friends. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

Ness

Jul 19, 2004, 05:47 PM

On 2004-07-19 14:51, Aredhel wrote:

On 2004-07-19 08:16, Ezellaur wrote:

Actually, no, they can't. All evidence online is circumstantial and would never hold up in court. Sure they could go get a warrant, but they would be wasting their time since they would have nothing to prosecute the person on. Online, you never know who you're talking to. The person could easily tell the cops he didn't really believe the person was underrage and just assumed they were of age, and the police would have nothing to prove him otherwise. The only way the police can arrest a person for that is if they meet in the real world and the person then solicites the minor.

OK, so maybe they won't actually enter your house with a swat team to arrest you ( I was exaggerating) but if you are caught by police at the designated meeting place, it is my understanding that you are promptly placed in cuffs and hauled off for what you didn't do. Of course, I am no expert on this subject, I'm just relaying what was told to us by an Internet Police Officer who came to visit our Info. Processing class. And some of you seem to know an awful lot about this subject...

Like em' young, huh?

*dons flame-retardant suit*

But that's still not policing the internet. That's the police using the internet as a tool to catch criminals.

Myopathy

Jul 19, 2004, 05:54 PM

On 2004-07-19 14:51, Aredhel wrote:
OK, so maybe they won't actually enter your house with a swat team to arrest you ( I was exaggerating) but if you are caught by police at the designated meeting place, it is my understanding that you are promptly placed in cuffs and hauled off for what you didn't do. Of course, I am no expert on this subject, I'm just relaying what was told to us by an Internet Police Officer who came to visit our Info. Processing class. And some of you seem to know an awful lot about this subject...

Like em' young, huh?

*dons flame-retardant suit*

I'm pretty sure they need the suspect to actually hint at sex or something sex-related. Otherwise, they would not have anything to prosecute the suspect with. There is no law that says an adult cannot carry a conversation with a minor he/she doesn't know. The law works in a way that only allows the police to prosecute based on actions, not intentions. They can't arrest you for any thoughts you have, but if you vocalize those thoughts, then they've got you.

Didn't you watch that episode of Reno 911? (Those of who have know what I'm talking about, hehe).

Madzozs

Jul 19, 2004, 06:28 PM

On 2004-07-17 10:05, AUTO_ wrote:
Someone should wipe out those websites that are just videoclips of death; whether they're real or not.

That shit doesn't benefit anyone...and I have to wonder what kind of mental-state the people who created those sites are in...as well as the people who go there to watch that shit.

I will defend this only because I have watched executions before. I have seen suicides. I have seen nearly everything involving insane death. Most has been on the internet. My mental-state is perfectly normal. The only reasons I have for watching these things are pure curiousity, desensitization. After being exposed to death at a young age, nearly dying myself numerous times, and seeing the wonders of Hollywood, I have nothing really left for scare factor. Everyone enjoys a scare now and again, but it takes a lot to fill that void. Most of the time(98%) I have watched these is out of curiousity though.

On 2004-07-18 20:52, Mixfortune wrote:
Internet licenses... akin to driver's licenses?
Not a bad idea at all... get tested on proper internet manners and required skills before going out and doing what you need to do. In a better world, perhaps...

The problem with this idea, is that as is obvious in the US with driver's licenses. People can lie when they want to. When I took my road test nearly 6 years ago I drove as close to perfect as possible. This granted me my license. Since then, I rarely drive perfectly. The only time I do this now is when I have a child in the car, or a pregnant lady. What will prevent people from pretending to be model internet "citizens" for a test/probational period or whatever?

Aredhel

Jul 19, 2004, 07:20 PM

On 2004-07-19 15:47, Ness wrote:

But that's still not policing the internet. That's the police using the internet as a tool to catch criminals.

http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_dead.gif

How do all of you define 'policing' the internet if the internet isn't used as a tool? That's all the internet is - a tool for a means. What it all comes down to is, are laws established to achieve something or is it so much as enforcement is a means for control? Once again, it all depends on how you view the legal system.

Are there limits in our society that stimulate enforcement because the authority deems it safer for people that way? Or are they just exerting their authority over us so that we can be...

http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_sheep.gif