Why is Whitill the "Best ID"?

[Skorpius]

Kefka: of course I am advising the best, that's why Whitill is the best
Kefka: besides, Whitill is not my favourite ID

As an example, Kef says it is the best ID, because of facts, not opinions.

What are these facts, if anyone knows? I would PM him, but I wish to hear from others. I am curious.

[Deus-Irae]

Child: "Momma. why is the sky blue?

Mother: "Because child, WHITILL>j00!!1 Now SHARAP!"

[SJ]

On 2005-02-20 02:15, Deus-Irae wrote:
Child: "Momma. why is the sky blue?

Mother: "Because child, WHITILL>j00!!1 Now SHARAP!"


Couldn't have put it better myself http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[Tycho]

The only way why Whitill could be considered a really good ID is because of the nice exclusives, and a lot of decent rares dropping at nice rates in the same area (in this case, Ruins).

Fact? There is no best ID. The few useful (best) items in the game are either pipable, ID-unrelated, possible to get within a day, or have their best droprates below Ultimate, meaning it would not be worth devoting your main character's ID to.

Opinion? I like Viridia better. And Pinkal. :o

[PJ]

Whitill has excellent rares, if not the best rares. Why would Kef not like it? Possibley cause these rares are really rare... although that doesn't seem like a problem for Kef http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[Blue-Hawk]

Whitill could be better. I have played the id on and off since v1. Never can get too many good thigs to drop, nor am I impressed with the drops.

[Akulamenuri]

I like the Whitill ID but I refuse to play Central Control Area on it.

[Dek]

From what I have seen, it has a nice variety of weapons for HUs and RAs at some decent drop rates. For example...

RAs can find BOTH Handgun: Guld and Mandgun: Milla with the ID

A lot of HU weapons can be found at some nice rates (Gol Dragon finds Asuka 1/8, which is pretty good IMO)

http://www.pso-world.com/item_findings.php?by=sectionid&sectionid=10&version=v3

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Arthas_Zero on 2005-02-20 13:58 ]</font>

[Skorpius]

So far, other IDs have these attributes, too.

Whitill has excellent rares, if not the best rares.

Purplenum has a lot of good rares, but it isn't seen as "The Best". I find Purplenum better than Whitill on this part, though, because it finds all three standard RA weapons, a great FO weapon, and some decent HU weapons, too. Not to mention an easy God/Ability drop, most useful unit in the game (and an easy God/Arm drop, too).

From what I have seen, it has a nice variety of weapons for HUs and RAs at some decent drop rates.

Other IDs have this attribute, as well.

The only thing I can tell is that Whitill has 3 ID exclusives in one area. That doesn't make it THE BEST, just a good idea to use in that one area.

[DLShAdOw]

what is the best Ra ID

[Skorpius]

On 2005-02-20 15:27, Skorpius wrote:
I find Purplenum better than Whitill on this part, though, because it finds all three standard RA weapons

[DLShAdOw]

thats what i was gonna do thanks

[Luis]

i wouldnt consider whitill as the best id because whitill is good for Ra and Hu but what about Forces???????, well if whitill has to be the best id it has to be the best id for all the classes including forces. Or maybe you are not counting forces as another class in the game and they are just handymans of the pso community.

[DezoPenguin]

Well...let's consider what Whitill offers for the various classes, as well as with assorted "popular" items. Nothing in order here, just more or less the order they enter my head:

RA--
1.The only legit possibility of getting a Guld Milla. And Whitill has to be in there somewhere 'cause Milla is an exclusive drop.
2.Red Mechguns (tied with Oran for easiest drop)
3.The Frozen Shooter, essential RA equipment (Purplenum, Greenill, and Yellowboze offer the same odds)
4.Yasminkov 2000H. Strictly prestige, but people like them.
5.Enough random L&K14 Combat drops to make it likely you'll score one with hit% along the way (until you finally generate some Charge Vulcans at the shop).

HU--
1.Pipable Red Partisan
2.Easy Red Saber drop from Hildelt
3.Red Sword off Melqueek (nowhere near as common as Skyly, but as good as anyone else's)
4.The game's best odds at a 1975 Agito (don't talk to me about Pinkal--you can get to the Pal Rappy drop in Pinkal at a lower level, but the actual odds are better in Whitill 'cause you can pipe 9 Mils in Waterfall Tears).
5.Pan Arms' Arms.
6.Sinow Red's Arms.
7.The game's best Meteor Cudgel drop.
8.The exclusive Flight Fan (and a pretty easy drop off a Nano).
9.Red Slicer.
10.Flight Cutter
11.Ancient Saber
12.The game's easiest chance to get an Asuka (Gol Dragon, or that easy drop from Mericarol if you prefer).
13.The best chance to score a Yamigarasu (Sinow Zele+Ill Gill...not sure if any online quests tip the scales in front of the Viridia Deldepth drop, though...).
14.The best chance to get a Rika's Claw (Delbiter).
15.Scores upon scores of Diskas of Braveman, offering an excellent chance to score a Berserk slicer with hit%.

FO--Obviously weakest here
1.Pipable Caduceus
2.Rico's Glasses as an exclusive drop
3.Gal Wind

Other assorted stuff:
1. Pipable Cure/Freeze.
2. The game's easiest PB/Create drop
3. Exclusive Rico's Earrings
4. Pipable Electro Frame
5. Red Scorpio, Red Handgun, Baranz Parts, Dragon's Claw, Sacred Guard, Guard Wave, Heaven Punisher, Ruby Bullet, Gi-Gue's Body, Morning Glory, Red Slicer, Flight Cutter, Secure Feet, Monkey King Bar, Lavis Cannon, Psycho Wand, Spirit Garment all available, though generally not at the best possible chances (or if it is, for a less valuable item).

While Purplenum is the best RA ID, Skyly is arguably the best HU ID (at least if you like swords) and I wouldn't recommend Whitill to any player using *only* a FO, Whitill offers a broad assortment of excellent drops, valuable exclusives, and quality pipables that complement any character or collection of characters. Added to that is the excellent Ruins, where everything that could drop is valuable (meaning, that you're never wasting your time killing monsters that only drop worthless crap). It's not the single best ID for any one class, but it simply offers so much for so many (and with relatively easy percentages), has excellent exclusives, and valuable pipables, that you can't do much better for picking a random ID out of a hat. That makes Whitill the "best ID" (or at least arguably so) when you ask the question without modifying clauses (like "best RA ID," "best FO ID," or "best Episode II ID").

[Tycho]

4.The game's best odds at a 1975 Agito (don't talk to me about Pinkal--you can get to the Pal Rappy drop in Pinkal at a lower level, but the actual odds are better in Whitill 'cause you can pipe 9 Mils in Waterfall Tears).

12.The game's easiest chance to get an Asuka (Gol Dragon, or that easy drop from Mericarol if you prefer).
13.The best chance to score a Yamigarasu (Sinow Zele+Ill Gill...not sure if any online quests tip the scales in front of the Viridia Deldepth drop, though...).


I beg to differ, recheck your numbers. Pal Rappies are easier to get to, so in the end it's the same. Asuka is even easier for Pinkal, same rate, but on Barba Ray. Yami is the same rate on several IDs, it's really flawed to put this under best drops for Whitill, it's almost ID-unrelated.

Also, for FOrces ID should barely matter. Good non-melee FOrce stuff, the Tech-boosting rares, are either really common (Paku Paku), ID-unrelated (Marina's Bag), or just fashion items (Bunny Wand, Evil Curst, Psycho Wand). There is no best FOrce ID, because for FOrces it just doesn't matter anything.

[Skorpius]

On 2005-02-20 17:48, DezoPenguin wrote:
Whitill offers a broad assortment of excellent drops, valuable exclusives, and quality pipables that complement any character or collection of characters.

Same can be said with most other IDs.
Purplenum offers quite a bit of HU weapons, has a good exclusive, and also has quality pipeables.
Oran does the same, (HU/Ra stuff, with decent exclusives) and Oran is classified as a bad ID, by most masses.

My confusion lingers.. If it's because Whitill has 3 exclusives in ruins, along with Cudgel, why is it labeled as "The Best"? I don't quite understand how 4 items in Ruins translates to "The Best" x.x



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Skorpius on 2005-02-20 21:09 ]</font>

[Luis]

its not the best it just, they are many whitill fans, and thats it

[Hrith]

Of course there are facts, if there weren't, we'd have a bunch of n00bs saying Bluefull and Pinkal are good IDs, get real.



On 2005-02-20 21:08, Skorpius wrote:
Same can be said with most other IDs.
Purplenum offers quite a bit of HU weapons, has a good exclusive, and also has quality pipeables.
Oran does the same, (HU/Ra stuff, with decent exclusives) and Oran is classified as a bad ID, by most masses.

My confusion lingers... If it's because Whitill has 3 exclusives in ruins, along with Cudgel, why is it labeled as "The Best"? I don't quite understand how 4 items in Ruins translates to "The Best" x.xIt's because you suck.
Read the whole post from DezoPenguin instead of quoting what allows you to post your bullshit.

Come on, you're comparing Whitill to Oran ? how stupid can you get ?
Do you realise how stupid your pseudo-arguments are ?
Like when you said Whitill was bad for wands with hit%... that's not even an argument, it's too retarded to be one.
Do you realise the kind of bullshit you have to come up with to make you feel you're right ?

Opinion: I like wands with hit%.
Fact: Sabers are better than wands.
Mathematically and logically, you fail.

But I do not talk to people who do not listen; you're not even posting this topic to be proven wrong, but to spread your bullshit, as you have many times in the past, already.

Back on the subject, this here topic has proven that I'm right several times:


On 2005-02-20 04:52, Tycho wrote:
Fact? There is no best ID. The few useful (best) items in the game are either pipable, ID-unrelated, possible to get within a day, or have their best droprates below UltimateThat is the most erroneous thing I heard about PSO in a while.
That is a fucking opinion.
For instance, I do not pipe and I do not care about 90% of the rares we get in lower difficulties.
Next...



On 2005-02-20 07:48, Blue-Hawk wrote:
I have played the ID on and off since v1. Never can get too many good thigs to drop, nor am I impressed with the drops.v1 and v2 are irrelevant.
Experience means nothing.



On 2005-02-20 19:42, Tycho wrote:
I beg to differ, recheck your numbers. Pal Rappies are easier to get to, so in the end it's the same.Wrong, if you consider piping it, Whitill is better. It's not like you will get the Agito in 10 rappies or less.
Remember VulpesMundi that went through 98 rare monsters before it dropped ?
Or Jason's 92 Hildetorrs that never dropped Syncesta ?
Or even me, I have slain 63 Pouilly Slimes, and no Lavis.
On average, Whitill is better, and average is what matters; "if you get lucky" is a retarded argument.
And if you do not pipe, Purplenum has the easiest Agito 1975, by very far.


Asuka is even easier for Pinkal, same rate, but on Barba Ray.Once again, wrong. They are as easy, but the easiest Asuka is in Whitill, from Mericarol.


Yami is the same rate on several IDs, it's really flawed to put this under best drops for Whitill, it's almost ID-unrelated.It's better in Whitill WT because 14 monsters drop it instead of 8.
Easiest Yamigarasu is Viridia, anyway, whether online or offline.

Whitill is not the best ID in the sense that it gets you all items in the game, motherfucking duh.

It's just that no other ID scores better on a general rule.

So when you look at all the drops (and rates, of course) of all IDs and as far as any class is concerned, Whitill wins; here's your fact.

And it's against the rules to disclose private conversations without all parties' consent.

On a final note, although he forgot some stuff, DezoPenguin summed up the facts rather well.
Deus, too.

The search function works again, use it, I have already exposed why Whitill and Purplenum are the best 2 IDs in this game, and I'm not explaining again, especially to people who blatantly refuse to learn.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kef on 2005-02-21 01:39 ]</font>

[Luis]

i belive purplenum is even with whitill, just because of the 1/205 pwand, yas 9000, and some other cool drops like god/ability, i got a purple ranger and i dont regret about it

[Hrith]

On 2005-02-21 02:07, Luis wrote:
i belive purplenum is even with whitill, just because of the 1/205 pwand, yas 9000, and some other cool drops like god/ability, i got a purple ranger and i dont regret about itI cannot believe you posted that comment RIGHT after my post x_X; There are at least 3 points in your three line post that proves that Whitill is better.

[Nai_Calus]

WHITILL is good because combined with a PURPLENUM, REDRIA and a fourth ID of your choosing, you'll be able to get basically everything you could ever possibly want. >_>;

There's no one 'best' ID, just a few that working together cover almost everything. >_>;

WHITILL happens to be one of those IDs. >_>;

Personally, I'm actually fonder of REDRIA, despite it's 'sucking', or how much people bitch that Heavenly/Battle(Which is currently only on one version of PSO that almost nobody plays...) being found on other IDs makes REDRIA 'useless'. Gee, I must be hallucinating the other good drops, eh? And man, who would EVER want an Iritista, right? 9_9

The definitive, final word on ID selection:

The best IDs are the ones that find what you want to find. No amount of fact or opinion in favour of any one ID or set of IDs can change this.

VIRIDIA is great to some, the best to others, and pure shit to others still who find nothing of interest there they can't get elsewhere.

To some, PURPLENUM is shit and, say, PINKAL is great. Now, you or I might say "WTF? Purple owns, pink sux0rz", but if the ID finds what the person professing it's glories wants, then to them, it IS a good ID. Period.

[Blue-Hawk]

On 2005-02-21 06:54, Ian-KunX wrote:



Personally, I'm actually fonder of REDRIA, despite it's 'sucking', or how much people bitch that Heavenly/Battle(Which is currently only on one version of PSO that almost nobody plays...) being found on other IDs makes REDRIA 'useless'. Gee, I must be hallucinating the other good drops, eh? And man, who would EVER want an Iritista, right? 9_9





Redria IS a great id.
What is a 'Heavenly/Battle'?

[Neith]

Whitill also has the 1/8 drop for the Asuka from Gol Dragon, id consider that an easier drop, since Spaceship runs dont take long. Even though Whitill is considered the best ID, I think that judging it that isnt fair, as other ID's have great areas (Skyly Cave,some Redria areas,even Yellowboze Ruins/Forest have great drops) I think that the fact that Whitill gets Rika's and Yami offline contributes to the general opinion, but in my opinion, Whitill is only marginally better than other ID's, just for the exclusive drops, and easy 75 Agito drop. Everythin else about it can be matched closely by another ID.

[Soja-Soulcrusher]

On 2005-02-21 07:11, Blue-Hawk wrote:


On 2005-02-21 06:54, Ian-KunX wrote:



Personally, I'm actually fonder of REDRIA, despite it's 'sucking', or how much people bitch that Heavenly/Battle(Which is currently only on one version of PSO that almost nobody plays...) being found on other IDs makes REDRIA 'useless'. Gee, I must be hallucinating the other good drops, eh? And man, who would EVER want an Iritista, right? 9_9





Redria IS a great id.
What is a 'Heavenly/Battle'?


'Heavenly/Battle' is the archaic name for 'God/Battle.'

ORAN is shit to collectors of uber rares, but some people just don't care... like me.

[Neith]

Heavenly/Battle is the new upgrade of God/Battle availa ble on Blue Burst.

[Soja-Soulcrusher]

On 2005-02-21 07:49, UrikoBB3 wrote:
Heavenly/Battle is the new upgrade of God/Battle availa ble on Blue Burst.


I stand corrected... and in awe. Why the HELL does THAT need an upgrade? Isn't it good enough?

[Skorpius]

On 2005-02-21 01:27, Kef wrote:
For instance, I do not pipe and I do not care about 90% of the rares we get in lower difficulties.

This nulls everything you just said, Kef. Nice way to front your opinions as facts and flame everyone else because they think differetly. You have your preferences, everyone else has theirs. Just because Whitill suits your needs doesn't make it "The Best" ID, and that doesn't make it "fact" either.

Kef, you don't have to flame people because facts and other opinions prove your opinion to be not so accurate and factual. ;/
Whitill is good because you've said other IDs get items better? And a general basis of items, Whitill only has 2-3 items per area, and most of that garbage can be found easier on other IDs.

Kef, people would most likely agree with you if you weren't so goddamn defensive and flamey, and had proof instead of "because it says so". I didn't post a fucking conversation, only a quote of you saying what you say all the goddamn time.

EDIT: ^_^



On 2005-02-21 01:27, Kef wrote:
n00bs, get real.
you suck.
your bullshit.
how stupid can you get ?
Do you realise how stupid your pseudo-arguments are ?
it's too retarded to be one.
Do you realise the kind of bullshit you have to come up with to make you feel you're right ?
you're not even posting this topic to be proven wrong, but to spread your bullshit.
I'm right several times: - Fucking hypocrite.
That is the most erroneous thing I heard about PSO in a while.
That is a fucking opinion. <- no shit, Sherlock.

For instance, I do not pipe and I do not care about 90% of the rares we get in lower difficulties.

OPINION. MANY PEOPLE LIKE DIFFERENT THINGS, YET YOU BASE WHITILL'S EXISTANCE AND VALUE ON ONLY WHAT YOU LIKE.

Experience means nothing. <- Yet you said Experience is worth more than my opinions. Hypocrite.

Wrong, if you consider piping it, Whitill is better.
Pinkal Pals are found easier than Whitill Mils. More Pal Rappies in FiY than Ob Lilies in Waterfall Tears.

Once again, wrong. They are as easy, but the easiest Asuka is in Whitill, from Mericarol.
Idiot, Barba Ray isn;t as difficult to fight as Mericarol. Get real, as you said.


It's better in Whitill WT because 14 monsters drop it instead of 8.
Yellowboze Ill Gill has chance of hit. You lose

Whitill is not the best ID in the sense that it gets you all items in the game, motherfucking duh.
It's just that no other ID scores better on a general rule.
Yes, other IDs do so, and are opinionly (new word) better than Whitill.

So when you look at all the drops (and rates, of course) of all IDs and as far as any class is concerned, Whitill wins; here's your fact.
Opinion. You like it, so it's the best for you, way to go. I would rather have Mechs and all the standard RA equiipment, so Purplenum is best for me. Learn these definitions, please:
Fact (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=Fact) / Opinion (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=Opinion)

You will realize that your judgments are only opnions, you're using certain facts to make an opinion and passing it off as fact because it makes you look and feel "leet", which is something you like to do, for some godawful reason.

And it's against the rules to disclose private conversations without all parties' consent.
No convo posted, two lines isn't a convo. Nothing was posted that is really that harmful to you, calm the fuck down.

people who blatantly refuse to learn.
You refuse to learn, as well. until you get your facts and opinions sorted out, and stop being such a fucking hypocrite, there really isn't a reason to listen to you anymore.

Warn me, Ban me, whatever. I'm sick of normal discussions getting out of hand for no reason, and I'm always the one being blamed.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Skorpius on 2005-02-21 10:05 ]</font>

[Tycho]

On 2005-02-21 01:27, Kef wrote:



On 2005-02-20 04:52, Tycho wrote:
Fact? There is no best ID. The few useful (best) items in the game are either pipable, ID-unrelated, possible to get within a day, or have their best droprates below Ultimate


That is the most erroneous thing I heard about PSO in a while.
That is a fucking opinion.
For instance, I do not pipe and I do not care about 90% of the rares we get in lower difficulties.
Next...

You are one of the very few people that does not pipe, and even if you don't rare enemy rates aren't that bad (1/2 Redria TTF is better than 1/2 Purplenum HS to find a Lavis). I know a lot of the sub-ult rares are bad, but I clearly specified I was talking about useful rares. Did you forget about most of the rare units, Paku Paku, D-Parts, S-Parts, Invisible Guard, Stink Frame and Spirit Garment or are you just omitting them?

So please do not 'next' me like I have no clue what I'm talking about. You know more about this game than I do, I admit. But I do think before I act. What ID you want is all about what rares you would prioritize.



On 2005-02-20 19:42, Tycho wrote:
I beg to differ, recheck your numbers. Pal Rappies are easier to get to, so in the end it's the same.

Wrong, if you consider piping it, Whitill is better. It's not like you will get the Agito in 10 rappies or less.
Remember VulpesMundi that went through 98 rare monsters before it dropped ?
Or Jason's 92 Hildetorrs that never dropped Syncesta ?
Or even me, I have slain 63 Pouilly Slimes, and no Lavis.
On average, Whitill is better, and average is what matters; "if you get lucky" is a retarded argument.
And if you do not pipe, Purplenum has the easiest Agito 1975, by very far.

I never said something about being lucky, what you said here seems irrelevant, and unrelated to your conclusion. I can partly understand how it's nicer to have 9 Lilies, but still, getting to the Lily spot takes way more time than getting to the Rappy spot (which takes only four rooms with enemies... Rappies even, one among the weakest monsters in Ultimate).



Asuka is even easier for Pinkal, same rate, but on Barba Ray.


Once again, wrong. They are as easy, but the easiest Asuka is in Whitill, from Mericarol.

Barba Ray is faster, because of RT. Not 'as easy'. Also, would you rather do twice as many 1/2 PW1's, than the number of 1/4 RT's it would take for one to drop? Pinkal has the best drop, not Whitill.

It's better in Whitill WT because 14 monsters drop it instead of 8.
Easiest Yamigarasu is Viridia, anyway, whether online or offline.

I think you took this from some guide that was written before PW4. I'm sorry, the easiest drop is from Ill Gill, with 72 potential drops per run. Also, Viridia has nothing to do with this, it's a worse drop. But I checked it, the best drop is a tie between Skyly, Whitill and Yellowboze. Meaning Boze is best because of hit.

It's just that no other ID scores better on a general rule.

General rule? I say Yasminkov9000M is more useful than Guld Milla. Also, for advanced players good odds for Lavis will probably be more important than, say, Cudgel. Several Whitill Ruins drops are popular, but those rares are easily replacable by similar items. Rico's Glasses is stylish, I'd want FOnewearls to be able to use them, but the thing is, drops for stylish rares do not count when it's abuot 'general rules'.

[Dhylec]

ok, i got to admit, this was a very interesting discussion..
but seems like conflicts & harsh words are inevitable
so let it rests everyone!
whoever couldn't hold back his/her tempers, consider this a verbal warning!