a "good" weapon

[Shiva91]

I have been hearing alot latley and its gotten to the point, what is a good weapon anymore? what determines it being good? does the weapon determine if its "good" or does the player? My friend was using a Cannon i gave him wich had 30% hit, i asked how much ata he had, and he told me, he had 122. I knew for a fact he had a crush Bullet, he doesnt use it cus his Cannon has 30 hit. So does a "good" wep come from Hit% or the special of the wep, or its rarety? i hope you get what im saying, http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif cus even tho i get it, im actually confusing myslef as i type this(5:30am)

Another one of those thing Shiva does to make you think ^~

[Tycho]

A weapon is good if it's relatively useful as compared to other weapons. A weapon is good enough to use if its advantages over one of the weapons you do use outweigh its disadvantages compared to that weapon.
What determines whether a weapon is useful?
For a nuke/support Force mainly technique bonuses, and maybe DFP/MST/EVP bonuses as well.
For meleeing (ranging counts) characters it's harder. You'll need to take into consideration:

- the median fully ground ATP
- ATP variance
- accuracy
- whether the weapon can combo
- how fast the weapon's animation would be on your character class
- what the weapons special is
- whether the special is reduced
- under what circumstances you are going to use the special (Berserk without a good FO? Hell in EP1? Arrest on a non-android in Towers? Demon's on an android while you could have a human/newman on your team do it instead?)
- radius
- range
- maximum number of targets, and how hard it is to hit multiple targets at once (Launchers are more useful at bosses, while Shots outclass them when trying to hit regular crowds)

If you don't have the weapon yet, you'll also have to consider how hard it is to get the weapon (and for S-ranks grind them and add the special), while you may want to go for more common alternatives with hit percentage. With hit, Final Impact is in no way a bad Shot, despite the fact it has only nine stars. It's a government prize for Rangers too, which is pretty cool. Still, under some circumstances (when you have plenty of accuracy, a good FO, strong adversaries) you may want to use an S-rank Shot with Berserk or Demon's instead. It is tough to make decisions. ;/

[kazuma56]

IMO its the player that determines a good weapon, although there will always be ones that are, and will be considered the "best" or "good" weapon to use, I'd use a Baranz Launcher over my Spread Needle anyday...it all depends on the player that makes a weapon good.

for instance, in the GC version I have a 55% demon's laser as my main weapon (gotta love greenill), and it's ATP is lacking compared to many other rifles out there but the special beats them all out by far.

BTW I think this will be moved since it's more of a weapons and items topic instead of a general one.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: kazuma56 on 2005-08-01 03:09 ]</font>

[Jason]

ATA > ATP

For example, I once had a 20% hit Last Survivor. That's 50 ATA it had.
I also had a Red Sword, of no hit %'s. That's 37 ATA it had.

Out of these 2, which did I use more? My Last Survivor, despite the fact that a Red Sword has greater ATP. But how is a weapon better, though with greater ATP, but can't hit as often? Okay, maybe I'm a little biased here because I just like the looks of the Last Survivor better (it do has a better special too). So depending on the player, style can be a part of a "good" weapon to him or her even though there's a superior weapon of the same class.

Something that is said that I agreed upon, each ATA (just 1) is worth about 10 ATP since they are two different things.

Do you now see why that some tends to use a decent-enough weapon of hit %'s over a superior weapon of less ATA for it supposedly having no hit %'s? A decent-enough weapon, if its rarity is lower than the superior weapon of the same class, you can get the decent-enough weapon more often than the rarer superior one ending up having a decent hit %'s. I'll give you an example:
A Demolition Comet and a Black King Bar. Both have the same special, and a Black King Bar's rarity is higher than of a Demolition Comet. Since you can get a Demolition Comet a lot more often, it is more likely for you to have one of a decent hit %'s than if you've finally found a Monkey King Bar for a Black King Bar. Until you've got a Monkey King Bar, you'll have to be lucky for it to have a decent hit %'s because it can take a while to get yourself another one.
So which is quicker to get? A Demolition Comet.
And which is quicker to get a weapon of hit %'s? A Demolition Comet.
Even though a Black King Bar has greater ATP, why using that over a Demolition Comet which can hit more often with its "most likely to have a decent hit %'s?"? And to some (or most), a Demolition Comet looks more appealing.

Example for a RA: Red Handgun and Heaven Punisher. lol, a Heaven Punisher's rarity is huge compare to a Red Handgun that you can get yourself a whole lot more often. And which you can get more often in a whole lot quicker, gets you one of hit %'s. A Red Handgun with that, you have yourself more ATA over the Heaven Punisher. If you've got a Heaven Punisher (a big if at that), you would either get hit %'s or none, or having hit %'s but having more on the Red Handgun which you can get a lot more often. But as a Heaven Punisher is so rare and it has an eye-candy special, some may be using it (and for style) even though it have less ATA than a Red Handgun (if having hit %'s).

There are more to it, adding on to what kazuma56 and Tycho have said, but I'll stop right here. I'm sorry if reading all of this is making your head hurt if you're having difficulty to understand all of this. By the way, I'm using comparing weapons from Ep 1 & 2 and not from BB, but that's not the point nor does it matter.

Since you're mainly a FO, maybe you'll need the experience of a HU/RA to fully understand all of this?

No offense or anything. http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Jason on 2005-08-01 07:38 ]</font>

[Kaio666]

i honestly believe it comes down to player preference in visual look and play style. for example i could argue with Kef about the greatness of the double cannon lol but honestly its not an issue. it all depends on if you take looks over power, or if you just wanna blow (or smash) the living crap out of everything in existance. at high levels or any level really it all comes down to what you like and how you play.

[Dana]

hhe, yeah

at higher levels the difference between weapons like

Our beloved Lavis brandes

are

http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gifanimations:P

well, not quite but, hehe

[Kaio666]

when you get to a certain lvl atp doesn't really matter anymore, it boils down to preference. once my 140 HUcaseal gets a little higher, i'm takin dark falz on with a saber lol.

[Rayokarna]

To tell you i rather use, Crush Bullet/Final Impact over my Spreed Needle any day. But i use my Srank Launcher+180 than my Red Scorpio, What was said about the HP is true. But i must say NUG Bazooka owns all.

[Blitzkommando]

It is all personal preference. The stats, the looks, the animations, the bonuses... All are chosen for personal taste. Apparently, many of my choices are not those of others, so I get a double bonus.

[Crimson-RAmar]

I like my meteor smash instead of the crush bullet.

[Hrith]

Meteor Smash is better than Crush Bullet >_>

What Tycho said stands above "personal preference".

You are free to like a "bad" weapon, that won't make it good.

[Shiva91]

when it comes down to Crush Bullet vs. Meteor Smash, you have to take "who" is using it, to me, a meteor smash is useless in terms of special. If im a Droid, how is taking TP going to help me? Crush bullet(specially in ep4) really is like a resta to my droid. I get hit and I use the special and im back to full health.

But to the point of ata vs. atp(wich this is pretty much half of what determines a "good" weapon)

I used to make my Chars have lots of power, like too much >> and my friend tells me

"Whats the purpose of all that power if you cant hit anything?"

He made his point when we did Ult ruins and all i could do was miss XD

(have to cut short g2g DX )

[Tycho]

Shiva, I think Kef was referring to the fact that Meteor Smash is a second stage 9-star rare, while Crush Bullet is a first stage 9-star rare.
... Also, it is not easier to get a Demolition Comet with 'decent hit', than it is to find a Monkey King Bar at all. In fact, it may be even easier to find a Monkey King Bar than to find a Demolition Comet.

[Jason]

On 2005-08-01 15:33, Tycho wrote:
... Also, it is not easier to get a Demolition Comet with 'decent hit', than it is to find a Monkey King Bar at all. In fact, it may be even easier to find a Monkey King Bar than to find a Demolition Comet.



Okay, so that's a bad example as you would put it. But right or wrong, you can still get the point. http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif I didn't play enough of Ep 2...

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Jason on 2005-08-02 06:31 ]</font>