Blackwaltz-R
Nov 12, 2005, 07:27 AM
This thread isn't meant to cause any uproars, only to illustarte a point, as were posts in another thread that got locked today.. but if the mods feel that this thread may cause another ruckus then don't hesitate to lock this one but I just want peeps to hear me out. This thread may seem pointless buy only to those who don't get the message and impresisons being expressed rather than focusing on what is contrary to how they feel.
I am not trying to change anyoens minds or opinions, I only want to stimulate thought and to express some of my own Ideas in a thread I expect to be very bloated.. sorry in advance.
At first I didn't plan to come back since my point would always get drowned out by what I say rather than what I mean. I even made the point that I wasn't bashing PSU yet for some only focused on the words rather than the message. If I didn't like the game I wouldn't be here, I wouldn't still play psoeps1&2 to pacify my anxiousness to play PSU. When you have thought about all the good things about somehting you look forward to theirs pretty much nothing else to focus on that some of the more negative things(atleast for someone like me who constantly thinks).
I could only Delude myself for so long till I started thinking about how this game measures up against games I'm playing now, and what it has to offer. One thing PSU and PSO alreadyhave going for them is the style. their Isn't any other game that can match its Sci-Fantasy style. as most other online adventure games sport the same thing of more traditional fantasy which gets monotonous.
All the pros in the world have already been said about this game, so you should still consider the cons since what we choose to play determines the future of the gaming industry. why do you think their is multiple Devil May Crys or Metal Gear Solids, they play ROUGHLY the same way and use alot of the same gameplay mechanics but throw a new twist and story and over all its MORE of the SAME.
PSU is essentially PSO but with an added race and less occupational restrictions in a new universe with a new story and some new or just revised trinkets. I am in no way trying to so that these are reasons not to play the game, cuz I DEFINATLY want to play this game VERY badly. I just can't ignore some of these issues tho since I run my whole life on a value system I develeped as I gre up and some of you definatly will develope ones for yourselves when you get older.
A friend of mine(who I met on PSO as is the majority of the peeps on my list) brought this point up when just asking me about the game.
Friend: When is PSU suppsoed to come out?
Me: Should be february
Friend: Ah, its pay to play right?
*this is something neither of us thought about until this point*
Me: Hm, It hasn't been anounced yet.
Friend: I see.. well the fee will more than likely determine if I play or not, I have enough games I pay for as it is and I want to spend cash I would use for new games on one game anymore.
Me: yeah same, we were able to splurge on PSO because those were the only games available to us at the time. They were vicious but, compared to the scope of other games, Paying for PSOv2 was definatly not worth it at all.
Friend: Yeah, all they did was release a 2nd version of the game with features they didn't have time to include in v1, primarily battle mode. If BA was in v1 no one would have bothered with v2, their may not have even been a v2 unless they expected people to pay for challenge mode, lobby soccer, new weapons and mags.
Oh, and ultimate mode with the lv 200 cap. Yeah, make ME pay YOU to make the game more of a chore to level now than a minuscule tedium, thats worth 5 dollars a month!
Me: Yeah these asthetical updates for making the same types of weapons we have now look different but stronger is a poor excuse of an update, It doesn't change the game at all. People that played PSU said that the game plays alot like PSO but with more to it. I was kinda relieved about that but now I realized that that sucks lol That means the game will look pretty new but feel like im playing roughly the same game. I wonder how much they expect us to pay for it.. That kinda ruins my outlook of the game now lol
Friend: Yeah the scope of PSU can't match the scope of [insert game that gives you more to do for your dollar] since it doesn't utilize a hard drive. Updates on PSU would be marginal at best, only serving the purpose of earning a weapon or mag that we otherwise wouldn't be able to obtain thru drops.
Me: Yeah, and to think I was SO close to playing blue burst after the beta. Although in my opinion itd be more worth it than PSU prolly since they can make some major updates with PC games. I gotta know the rest of the story cuz the investigations was compelling like ****.
Friend: Meh, all those new weapons that they are sporting are just the same weapons but with new looks and ****.
Me: Nuh uhn?
Friend: Yeah, youd be paying to play a game with a new area and some Sabers with different colors and **** lol
Me: hm.. Then I'll prolly just stick with Monster Hunter 2 then. Man.. If PSO had play mechanics like MH that obliterates grinding at the cost of making it quest based and give you more of a sense of occupational duty, that would ****ing own. Man PSU would fit well with that type of game mechanic, making doing missions alot more meaningful then doing them for the sake of doing them for a reward and to progress thru a less compelling story to give these quests depth.
Friend: When is MH2 coming out?
Me: prolly spring, I doubt it'll be as deep as PSU but the gameplay will be WAY better anyway. Hopefully that won't end up pay to play.. the JP versions were but not the US versions. AFter playing MH tho I don't think I can stand PSUs character animations, they look too.. artificial.. MH used motion capture for their character animations so the game felt more organic and your character felt alive. When I look at the PSU vids.. the characters only move their legs while they move forward.. looks nasty as ****.
Friend: Ah, so they will prolyl be out around the sme time I see.
I know I would play PSU alot longer, but thats only because of level grinding, not because I find the game so fun I can't put it down. Rather they put a goal to get to 200, therefore I can't stop playing till then, since playing the story mode alone will not make this game worth it at only 40 hours. I would rather have an offline only version where I can do all the repetative dungeon runs at my leisure and not feeling obligated to gain 20 levels a month to get my moneys worth. Not that playing the game online for that much means I am actually getting my moneys worth since I can only have 2 choices--pay or don't.
Friend: Yeah I work all day and only get home around midnight every night, I wouldn't really get my moneys worth. Its bad enough I bother to play [insert an MMO name here] since I only play from midnight-5am then I sleep so I can get up for work. >.<
Me: Yeah same with my classes, its funny how the path to designing my own games gets in the way of my gaming. >.<
Anyways I hope they will give you the option to have a limited account where you can play all you want, but are not allowed to recieve quest updates which would justify their payment scheme. or they should release an offline only version with no network access for some offline level grinding at my leisure, or atleast throw in a LAN option or somethn for the console version since anyone who gets the PC version will deffinatly go online.
If an Idea like that doesn't get utilized before I finally head a project I may implement them myself. XD Then again .hack//fragment is utilizing something like that, it pretty much relys on it. You host your server on your PC and you and 2 other peeps connect thru your PS2s. I think its only 3 players do do bandwidth constraints but playing with more players isn't a big deal, I'm sure itll work for this game since I think you can host your own events and such.
Friend: Oh yeah? sounds intriguing, I guess its free since you host on your own machine?
Me: Yeah basiclly, this'll be 2 online games worth getting over PSU as long as MH2 doesn't end up having a fee but I don't really see how it would since the first MH had a a scope no bigger than PSO. Granted MH Only lets players play with peeps from their own country unlike PSO but having that option isn't that big a deal since a game like MH can't afford lag.
So yeah if PSU doesn't meet our criteria we can just settle for other games since Sega doesn't take into account that the players have choices and don't have to settle for bull****. They are suppsoed to do what they can to get us to play their game, making them pay for a game they already own is just ludacrist. The least they could do is pass on the savings buy retailing it for like 20 dollars lol
My ass only bought FFXI because it dropped to 20 dollars, and that was worth it. Guldwars tho.. It was ok.. but not worth 58 dollars.. even if it is free, I quit that game after 2 weeks lol
Friend: I enjoyed it for a while, it was a good execution but, the over all game was just.. meh.
Me: Yeah they have the right idea, their is no reason why a game should be completely server side. Letting the towns serve as the lobbies to meet up with other players to start a party and then going on your personal adventures OFF the central server and just between the players clients. This way ****ers don't have to charge you for bandwidth constraints. We do NOT need to be able to see every other player in the zone for the sake of giving us the sense of a massive world.
Friend: When I beat all the missions on GW I was just like, "hm, now what?" their was no way I was gonna do that PvP ****.
Me: lol cooze, I told you it woudnlt be worth it http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif
Anyways you basiclly you hook up with 5 other players from the hub town out of hundreds of peeps. embark on your quests with your peeps in your own instance off the central server. No extra processing power for characters that aren't in your party. Everyone wins.
Hopefully if their is a PSU v2 they will utilize such features for the sake of taking hosted games off the central server so they won't have to charge us to enjoy the product we purchased. Cuz they basiclly ruined the replay value by putting a story mode which I doubt anyone would want to play over and over again if they don't have an ISP or don't want to pay the fee. Tho as far as I know their could be more to the story mode than I think, All I can think of is after you beat the game offline, you can continue to go around and kill ****.
I think I'll cut it here since I know this seems like just a giant rant or nonsense topic. This shows that I have alot on my mind and I look at things and take alot of considerations of various aspects of whatever I am thinking about. I put an equal amount of deliberation into my feelings towards PSU and alot of it is relative to info I don't even have yet, but I am awaiting answers for.
I expect most peeps to only consider:
graphics & visual style
gameplay
features
track record if it is't the first of the franchise as a template of what to expect from the new release.
Many of you can make your decisions about a game with these aspects, I used to when I was younger.
SOme of you, and more of you will later start to also consider:
if its a sequel, how much of it is the same, how much of it is new.
does it offer more of the same.
What other games of the same type I would I be able to choose over this one.
Is it betetr than other games of the same type I can choose from?
Do various aspects of the game justify themselves? or are they their just to add empty features that are easily ignorable and don't serve any real merit to add anything substancial to the game?
What kind of depth does it offer? does it offer you fruitless distractions to give you the illusion that the time you take to go through the game actually takes that long? (like level grinding http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif)
Is it challenging? does it challenge your gameplay skills? (intelectual challenges are a plus) Does the game rely on sending a swarm of baddies to overwhelm you since they can't make the A.I. complex enough to actually beat you if they were to come alone? (like a bunch of one player action games do http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif)
These are only a few things that someone like me and some of you may take into consideration. I especially have to think about stuff like this If I want to have a chance in the gaming industry. You have to know what to offer, what can be offered, what is already offered, what isn't offered. This doesn't apply to just this topic it can be applyed to anything.
I can pretty much only share my Ideas with those who share a similiar outlook as me, hense why I haven't posted here in like 2 years lol I would get frustrated at peeps who wouldn't pay attention to the point I was making rather than the things I was saying.
PSU will definatly be a good game but will it be great? WIll it be "gooder" or "greater" than other games of the same type?
I am not trying to change anyoens minds or opinions, I only want to stimulate thought and to express some of my own Ideas in a thread I expect to be very bloated.. sorry in advance.
At first I didn't plan to come back since my point would always get drowned out by what I say rather than what I mean. I even made the point that I wasn't bashing PSU yet for some only focused on the words rather than the message. If I didn't like the game I wouldn't be here, I wouldn't still play psoeps1&2 to pacify my anxiousness to play PSU. When you have thought about all the good things about somehting you look forward to theirs pretty much nothing else to focus on that some of the more negative things(atleast for someone like me who constantly thinks).
I could only Delude myself for so long till I started thinking about how this game measures up against games I'm playing now, and what it has to offer. One thing PSU and PSO alreadyhave going for them is the style. their Isn't any other game that can match its Sci-Fantasy style. as most other online adventure games sport the same thing of more traditional fantasy which gets monotonous.
All the pros in the world have already been said about this game, so you should still consider the cons since what we choose to play determines the future of the gaming industry. why do you think their is multiple Devil May Crys or Metal Gear Solids, they play ROUGHLY the same way and use alot of the same gameplay mechanics but throw a new twist and story and over all its MORE of the SAME.
PSU is essentially PSO but with an added race and less occupational restrictions in a new universe with a new story and some new or just revised trinkets. I am in no way trying to so that these are reasons not to play the game, cuz I DEFINATLY want to play this game VERY badly. I just can't ignore some of these issues tho since I run my whole life on a value system I develeped as I gre up and some of you definatly will develope ones for yourselves when you get older.
A friend of mine(who I met on PSO as is the majority of the peeps on my list) brought this point up when just asking me about the game.
Friend: When is PSU suppsoed to come out?
Me: Should be february
Friend: Ah, its pay to play right?
*this is something neither of us thought about until this point*
Me: Hm, It hasn't been anounced yet.
Friend: I see.. well the fee will more than likely determine if I play or not, I have enough games I pay for as it is and I want to spend cash I would use for new games on one game anymore.
Me: yeah same, we were able to splurge on PSO because those were the only games available to us at the time. They were vicious but, compared to the scope of other games, Paying for PSOv2 was definatly not worth it at all.
Friend: Yeah, all they did was release a 2nd version of the game with features they didn't have time to include in v1, primarily battle mode. If BA was in v1 no one would have bothered with v2, their may not have even been a v2 unless they expected people to pay for challenge mode, lobby soccer, new weapons and mags.
Oh, and ultimate mode with the lv 200 cap. Yeah, make ME pay YOU to make the game more of a chore to level now than a minuscule tedium, thats worth 5 dollars a month!
Me: Yeah these asthetical updates for making the same types of weapons we have now look different but stronger is a poor excuse of an update, It doesn't change the game at all. People that played PSU said that the game plays alot like PSO but with more to it. I was kinda relieved about that but now I realized that that sucks lol That means the game will look pretty new but feel like im playing roughly the same game. I wonder how much they expect us to pay for it.. That kinda ruins my outlook of the game now lol
Friend: Yeah the scope of PSU can't match the scope of [insert game that gives you more to do for your dollar] since it doesn't utilize a hard drive. Updates on PSU would be marginal at best, only serving the purpose of earning a weapon or mag that we otherwise wouldn't be able to obtain thru drops.
Me: Yeah, and to think I was SO close to playing blue burst after the beta. Although in my opinion itd be more worth it than PSU prolly since they can make some major updates with PC games. I gotta know the rest of the story cuz the investigations was compelling like ****.
Friend: Meh, all those new weapons that they are sporting are just the same weapons but with new looks and ****.
Me: Nuh uhn?
Friend: Yeah, youd be paying to play a game with a new area and some Sabers with different colors and **** lol
Me: hm.. Then I'll prolly just stick with Monster Hunter 2 then. Man.. If PSO had play mechanics like MH that obliterates grinding at the cost of making it quest based and give you more of a sense of occupational duty, that would ****ing own. Man PSU would fit well with that type of game mechanic, making doing missions alot more meaningful then doing them for the sake of doing them for a reward and to progress thru a less compelling story to give these quests depth.
Friend: When is MH2 coming out?
Me: prolly spring, I doubt it'll be as deep as PSU but the gameplay will be WAY better anyway. Hopefully that won't end up pay to play.. the JP versions were but not the US versions. AFter playing MH tho I don't think I can stand PSUs character animations, they look too.. artificial.. MH used motion capture for their character animations so the game felt more organic and your character felt alive. When I look at the PSU vids.. the characters only move their legs while they move forward.. looks nasty as ****.
Friend: Ah, so they will prolyl be out around the sme time I see.
I know I would play PSU alot longer, but thats only because of level grinding, not because I find the game so fun I can't put it down. Rather they put a goal to get to 200, therefore I can't stop playing till then, since playing the story mode alone will not make this game worth it at only 40 hours. I would rather have an offline only version where I can do all the repetative dungeon runs at my leisure and not feeling obligated to gain 20 levels a month to get my moneys worth. Not that playing the game online for that much means I am actually getting my moneys worth since I can only have 2 choices--pay or don't.
Friend: Yeah I work all day and only get home around midnight every night, I wouldn't really get my moneys worth. Its bad enough I bother to play [insert an MMO name here] since I only play from midnight-5am then I sleep so I can get up for work. >.<
Me: Yeah same with my classes, its funny how the path to designing my own games gets in the way of my gaming. >.<
Anyways I hope they will give you the option to have a limited account where you can play all you want, but are not allowed to recieve quest updates which would justify their payment scheme. or they should release an offline only version with no network access for some offline level grinding at my leisure, or atleast throw in a LAN option or somethn for the console version since anyone who gets the PC version will deffinatly go online.
If an Idea like that doesn't get utilized before I finally head a project I may implement them myself. XD Then again .hack//fragment is utilizing something like that, it pretty much relys on it. You host your server on your PC and you and 2 other peeps connect thru your PS2s. I think its only 3 players do do bandwidth constraints but playing with more players isn't a big deal, I'm sure itll work for this game since I think you can host your own events and such.
Friend: Oh yeah? sounds intriguing, I guess its free since you host on your own machine?
Me: Yeah basiclly, this'll be 2 online games worth getting over PSU as long as MH2 doesn't end up having a fee but I don't really see how it would since the first MH had a a scope no bigger than PSO. Granted MH Only lets players play with peeps from their own country unlike PSO but having that option isn't that big a deal since a game like MH can't afford lag.
So yeah if PSU doesn't meet our criteria we can just settle for other games since Sega doesn't take into account that the players have choices and don't have to settle for bull****. They are suppsoed to do what they can to get us to play their game, making them pay for a game they already own is just ludacrist. The least they could do is pass on the savings buy retailing it for like 20 dollars lol
My ass only bought FFXI because it dropped to 20 dollars, and that was worth it. Guldwars tho.. It was ok.. but not worth 58 dollars.. even if it is free, I quit that game after 2 weeks lol
Friend: I enjoyed it for a while, it was a good execution but, the over all game was just.. meh.
Me: Yeah they have the right idea, their is no reason why a game should be completely server side. Letting the towns serve as the lobbies to meet up with other players to start a party and then going on your personal adventures OFF the central server and just between the players clients. This way ****ers don't have to charge you for bandwidth constraints. We do NOT need to be able to see every other player in the zone for the sake of giving us the sense of a massive world.
Friend: When I beat all the missions on GW I was just like, "hm, now what?" their was no way I was gonna do that PvP ****.
Me: lol cooze, I told you it woudnlt be worth it http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif
Anyways you basiclly you hook up with 5 other players from the hub town out of hundreds of peeps. embark on your quests with your peeps in your own instance off the central server. No extra processing power for characters that aren't in your party. Everyone wins.
Hopefully if their is a PSU v2 they will utilize such features for the sake of taking hosted games off the central server so they won't have to charge us to enjoy the product we purchased. Cuz they basiclly ruined the replay value by putting a story mode which I doubt anyone would want to play over and over again if they don't have an ISP or don't want to pay the fee. Tho as far as I know their could be more to the story mode than I think, All I can think of is after you beat the game offline, you can continue to go around and kill ****.
I think I'll cut it here since I know this seems like just a giant rant or nonsense topic. This shows that I have alot on my mind and I look at things and take alot of considerations of various aspects of whatever I am thinking about. I put an equal amount of deliberation into my feelings towards PSU and alot of it is relative to info I don't even have yet, but I am awaiting answers for.
I expect most peeps to only consider:
graphics & visual style
gameplay
features
track record if it is't the first of the franchise as a template of what to expect from the new release.
Many of you can make your decisions about a game with these aspects, I used to when I was younger.
SOme of you, and more of you will later start to also consider:
if its a sequel, how much of it is the same, how much of it is new.
does it offer more of the same.
What other games of the same type I would I be able to choose over this one.
Is it betetr than other games of the same type I can choose from?
Do various aspects of the game justify themselves? or are they their just to add empty features that are easily ignorable and don't serve any real merit to add anything substancial to the game?
What kind of depth does it offer? does it offer you fruitless distractions to give you the illusion that the time you take to go through the game actually takes that long? (like level grinding http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif)
Is it challenging? does it challenge your gameplay skills? (intelectual challenges are a plus) Does the game rely on sending a swarm of baddies to overwhelm you since they can't make the A.I. complex enough to actually beat you if they were to come alone? (like a bunch of one player action games do http://pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif)
These are only a few things that someone like me and some of you may take into consideration. I especially have to think about stuff like this If I want to have a chance in the gaming industry. You have to know what to offer, what can be offered, what is already offered, what isn't offered. This doesn't apply to just this topic it can be applyed to anything.
I can pretty much only share my Ideas with those who share a similiar outlook as me, hense why I haven't posted here in like 2 years lol I would get frustrated at peeps who wouldn't pay attention to the point I was making rather than the things I was saying.
PSU will definatly be a good game but will it be great? WIll it be "gooder" or "greater" than other games of the same type?