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X-thirteen
Sep 26, 2002, 09:44 PM
well last night i was talking to this girl who i have been hanging out with a lot the past few months. i like her she likes me... and awhile ago i remember her saying she does not want to be in a relationship right now... so we were talking last night and shes told me she wants to tell me something... "i just wanted to tell you this... im going out with someone". after she said that it felt like she ripped out my heart, threw it on the ground and lit it on fire. probably one of the worst pains ive ever felt in my entire life. all i can do is just think about that one line. i feel like crap, right now i wish i was dead.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: X-thirteen on 2002-09-27 16:34 ]</font>

BlackRose
Sep 26, 2002, 09:52 PM
I know how you feel, i've had the same thing happen to me before. And there are few feelings worse. I wish i could say something to make you feel better, but my experience was that the only salve was time.

Just remember, there are a lot of fish in the ocean. You'll pull through.

X-thirteen
Sep 26, 2002, 09:55 PM
i really thought we had something special though..

Kent
Sep 26, 2002, 10:09 PM
On 2002-09-26 19:44, X-thirteen wrote:
right now i wish i was dead.


No, you don't. Death is the end of all known existance, so never tell yourself something like this, nothing good can ever come out of it.

Just be glad you two are still friends, so if something goes wrong for either of you (other than this situation) you'll have someone to talk to and a shoulder to cry on.

Don't dwell on it, get on with your life and make us proud of something...

Spy
Sep 26, 2002, 10:57 PM
I feel depressed too. If I didn't have work tomorrow I'd drown myself in alcohol right now.

The bottom line is that girls suck.

If men weren't such pigs I'd think about going gay.

LollipopLolita
Sep 26, 2002, 11:32 PM
On 2002-09-26 20:57, Spy wrote:
The bottom line is that girls suck.


I thought that was why guys like girls, cuz we suck. well... ^_~

i like being a girl

pixelate
Sep 26, 2002, 11:34 PM
Just don't start blaming anybody. It's not their fault they're enjoying themselves. And it's not your fault she didn't go for you.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: pixelate on 2002-09-29 18:54 ]</font>

Spy
Sep 26, 2002, 11:38 PM
On 2002-09-26 21:32, LollipopLolita wrote:

I thought that was why guys like girls, cuz we suck. well... ^_~


Well, that's the most double-edged of swords.



i like being a girl



I still say you're a man with an identity crisis.

"What's the point of living if you don't have a dick?"

LollipopLolita
Sep 26, 2002, 11:40 PM
On 2002-09-26 21:38, Spy wrote:
"What's the point of living if you don't have a dick?"

to suck? well?

Spy
Sep 26, 2002, 11:44 PM
On 2002-09-26 21:40, LollipopLolita wrote:

to suck? well?



I've lost my edge. I'm going to go cry myself to sleep. Literally.

ABDUR101
Sep 27, 2002, 04:36 AM
On 2002-09-26 21:44, Spy wrote:
I'm going to go cry myself to sleep. Literally.


...this is only the 5th time I've seen you do that. o_O

Why don't you come over my place, cry on my shoulder as you goto sleep? =X

X-thirteen, I have to agree with the others. Don't let it get you too down, she was enjoying herself, and you were no doubt enjoying yourself, right? You felt great for the while you were together. And she already told you before that she did'nt want a relationship =

I think when you get involved with someone next, and you're looking for a relationship, make it clear along the line that thats what you want. If they agree, then thats great, and if not, then just say you only want to be friends, otherwise you'll just get hurt again. x_X

Balthor
Sep 27, 2002, 06:49 AM
Girls... *Laughs* Go figure, trying to understand em' is like trying to understand Ozzy Osbourne's speach. Just go do something to take your mind of her, get drunk, go play a game and kill something, go watch a movie.

It ain't the end of the world.

_xX_Frosty_Xx_
Sep 27, 2002, 07:20 AM
Don't blame yourself for it. I always learned from these experiences to let a girl before-hand know if I want to get with her. It's always harder to go from a friendship to a relationship anyway. Don't kick yourself for it next time, just let them know up front.

RavenTW
Sep 27, 2002, 07:39 AM
I'm sorry to here that X. I can't really give you any advice, just my condolences.

Abaddon
Sep 27, 2002, 09:47 AM
X, it may be confronting, but if she did that to you she wasnt worth being with in the first place. That sort of behaviour around a person like you (who, like you said, had a great thing going between the two of you), she probably does that a lot of the time in other situations. If just the once brings you this much pain, imagine a lifetime...

But dont feel too bad mate, like the others have said before, its not the one and only girl you'll know. It may take you several tries before you find someone. I know it did for me. We're all different.
*hugs* you'll be fine mate, you'll pull through. trust me http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Abaddon.

Spy
Sep 27, 2002, 11:28 AM
On 2002-09-27 02:36, ABDUR101 wrote:

...this is only the 5th time I've seen you do that. o_O


It's become one of my favorite hobbies http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



Why don't you come over my place, cry on my shoulder as you goto sleep? =X



...Why don't you mail the $24.99 you owe me. That would brighten up my day even more X'D

googles
Sep 27, 2002, 12:00 PM
same EXACT thing happen to me bro...Me and this one chick had all the same classes, so we started to talk and stuff. We got close then all of a sudden she told me that she was going to ask this guy out. At first i thought she was kidding, but they started going out. I was depressed for a month or 2. I know how you feel http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: googles on 2002-09-27 10:01 ]</font>

ABDUR101
Sep 27, 2002, 06:00 PM
On 2002-09-27 09:28, Spy wrote:
...Why don't you mail the $24.99 you owe me. That would brighten up my day even more X'D


OMFG! STFU! GDTH, DNPG!

...I just got paid, I'll send it o_O

..the next time I get an envelope and stamps.

.next month

On Topic!

X-13, let us know what has happened since then. I mean have you talked to her about it at all or what?

I would'nt say just go get drunk and act as if it's nothing, I mean you can't just forget something like this by downing a fricken six pack.

*God/Sarcasm ++*
That's great advice
*end God/Sarcasm ++*

Get over it, but in your own time, and not with the use of crap like alcohol. Drowning your pain isn't any good, but wallowing in it isn't good either.

The best things you can do? Spend time to yourself and think things over, go out with friends and have alittle fun. =)
That's great advice, pfft

X-thirteen
Sep 27, 2002, 06:30 PM
she says that she doesnt want to hurt me.
she was like i dont know how this changes anything between us, i beg to differ...



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: X-thirteen on 2002-09-27 16:32 ]</font>

ABDUR101
Sep 27, 2002, 07:32 PM
God..to be immature again. o_o

*holds hand over alot of people's mouths*

Appearently she doesn't realise that for every action, there is an equal reaction. =o

...Damn..Newton would be so proud of me.

I guess she either has her head up her ass pretty far, or she's playing stupid =

Common sense goes so far if only people would use it.

If you thought you were in a relationship and she's going out with other guys...I mean..how can that NOT change anything? Maybe she's stupid and thought you knew she was going out with other guys, even though you weren't going out with any other girls...?

_xX_Frosty_Xx_
Sep 27, 2002, 07:49 PM
I agree with what Abbadon said. If she treated you that way, maybe you shouldn't have been with her. I think she knew extactly what she did. Let us know what's going on....

Lileya
Sep 27, 2002, 07:56 PM
Wtf are you accusing this girl of?! Falling in love with someone?! O_O I mean, she didn't promise him anything, they were just friends, she can go out with whoever she wants! What, you would like her to force herself to love X?! Guys and girls can't just be friends?! You don't control a heart to fall in love you know...

I remember once I was friend with a guy, I never went out with this guy, we were just friends, and then one day he felt in love with me! I didn't love this guy, so what else could I have done other than telling him I'm not interested?! I understand he could get hurt, but would I have to force myself to go out with him so he won't get hurt? I'd rather disappoint someone than lie to this person!

I don't understand where you guys take your logic...

pixelate
Sep 27, 2002, 08:15 PM
On 2002-09-27 17:56, Mrs_Rohrbach wrote:
I mean, she didn't promise him anything, they were just friends, she can go out with whoever she wants! What, you would like her to force herself to love X?! Guys and girls can't just be friends?! You don't control a heart to fall in love you know...


Exactically. Can't make people fall in and out of love, unless Cupid's a reality.

ABDUR101
Sep 27, 2002, 09:30 PM
I was under the impression that X-13 and this girl were going out together. Whether there was love involved or not I don't care.

The point I'm making is that while X-13 was only going out with her, devoting himself to her, she was going out/dating another guy. Right?

I don't expect anyone to "fall in love", not by a long shot. My bitxh session is about this girl going out with X-13 and then saying she's dating someone else.

Thus why I said in my first post, the next time he gets with someone, to make sure they know that he wants a closed relationship, no dating of anyone else.

Shank you.

*flips back to page one*

pixelate
Sep 27, 2002, 09:45 PM
On 2002-09-27 19:30, ABDUR101 wrote:
I was under the impression that X-13 and this girl were going out together.





On 2002-09-26 19:44, X-thirteen wrote:
well last night i was talking to this girl who i have been hanging out with a lot the past few months.

ABDUR101
Sep 27, 2002, 10:02 PM
Well shit, thanks pixel. The way it read the first time was that they were together and she just came out and said "oh, by the way, I'm dating someone else.".

Well X-13, I say go have some damn fun and get your mind off it. You might have blown this...friendship/relationship alittle out of proportion. You're together or you weren't. If you just hung out, then yeah I can see her dating others. She told you she did'nt want a relationship, which means she prolly likes you as a friend. Be glad for that, seriously.

Wow, you know what this calls for?

*pulls out small case, opens it up and takes out the World's Smallest Violin and begins to play, just for X-13*...

=)

LollipopLolita
Sep 27, 2002, 10:41 PM
why is everyone blaming the girl. it was a nice gentle way of saying all i want to be is friends, what's wrong with that. if it was meant to be then it would have been, but she was meant to be with the other guy. can't blame her for feeling the way she does for the other guy. you could still be friends with her, you know, just an idea.

Abaddon
Sep 27, 2002, 10:49 PM
On 2002-09-27 16:30, X-thirteen wrote:
she says that she doesnt want to hurt me.
she was like i dont know how this changes anything between us, i beg to differ...

Post count: 1337. Keep it there X! http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Anyhow, back on track, she's probably unaware of your feelings, thats perhaps why she felt confident in telling you and doesnt realise the impact she's done: this is common.

But look at it this way, she's been honest with you, be honest with her. tell her how it makes you feel. if you two value your f'ship that much, telling her your pain would not dent it one bit.

*Sits with Abdur and pulls out theWorld's Second Smallest Violin*

X-thirteen
Sep 28, 2002, 03:04 AM
ok well after i bought my new cd-rw drive(which rocks btw) i picked her up and we talked for an hour or so... we didnt talk about anything serious though. i guess i gotta wait til she comes back from her trip to talk about the serious stuff.

btw abdur i never said we were going out. just really good friends... but i was talking to my best friend earlier and he thought of us as boyfriend and girlfriend without all the kissing and stuff like that... when was the last time you spent 3-4 hours with someone of the opposite sex in your bedroom? i guess you just have to be in my shoes to fully understand the situation..

Kent
Sep 28, 2002, 03:39 AM
On 2002-09-28 01:04, X-thirteen wrote:
i was talking to my best friend earlier and he thought of us as boyfriend and girlfriend without all the kissing and stuff like that...

Really good friends. Those are nice. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif


when was the last time you spent 3-4 hours with someone of the opposite sex in your bedroom? i guess you just have to be in my shoes to fully understand the situation..


I remember the last time that happened to me! We were parked in front of my TV playing Super Puzzle Fighter II Turbo and Virtual On until her parents called.

Fun, fun.

Sedyne
Sep 28, 2002, 08:26 AM
On 2002-09-26 19:44, X-thirteen wrote:
well last night i was talking to this girl who i have been hanging out with a lot the past few months. i like her she likes me... and awhile ago i remember her saying she does not want to be in a relationship right now... so we were talking last night and shes told me she wants to tell me something... "i just wanted to tell you this... im going out with someone". after she said that it felt like she ripped out my heart, threw it on the ground and lit it on fire. probably one of the worst pains ive ever felt in my entire life. all i can do is just think about that one line. i feel like crap, right now i wish i was dead.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: X-thirteen on 2002-09-27 16:34 ]</font>


I feel for you man. I've had some wierd stuff going on lately too with girls again...same old girl+anotehr...which is depressing. just take care man, don't let it get you down. there's alot of girls. just find one that's nice.

Ziggy-san
Sep 28, 2002, 10:41 PM
X-13, at least you had something for a while. It's really too bad but...

Lately I've decided to just give up with girls altogether. They're all manipulative mindless bitches that seek to destroy. Besides, friends are so much better. Not that "let's just be friends" bullchit, I mean actual friends that can talk and gripe or talk about the same kind of things. Once you become girlfriend/boyfriend, though I've never known the feeling, it's just that much more complicated.

Of course, you prolly have NO idea what I'm talking about..but that's okay.

Of course, my attitude is subject to change, but that's what I believe as of now, and I'm quite happy. There's this one girl in my skool..she's a senior (two years older) but really cool, a lot like me, had a boyfriend (and is "engaged" or something, i.e they're marying in a few years o.0) and yet we are goign to a Korn concert next Wednesday. The beauty of it all is that it's strictly a friend thing.

You see what I'm getting at? So that's where I stand now.

Gah...I repeat myself too much...

Saladwood
Sep 28, 2002, 10:50 PM
So, if you want them as a friend and they want the same it's ok.

But if you want them as more, and they want you as a friend, "They're all manipulative mindless bitches that seek to destroy."

Hmmm, what an insightful statement.

What about all the boys that only want to talk to the girls that they think they have a chance of getting in their pants?

Lets not GENERALIZE here?

Kid_Icarus
Sep 28, 2002, 10:52 PM
You can't ever give up on love.
It could happen tomarrow, it could happen in a week or two.
But it eventually happens to everyone.
As lonely as I've ever felt, as down as I've felt. I've never given up on finding someone.

X-thirteen
Sep 28, 2002, 11:38 PM
On 2002-09-28 20:50, PSOSaladWood wrote:
So, if you want them as a friend and they want the same it's ok.

But if you want them as more, and they want you as a friend, "They're all manipulative mindless bitches that seek to destroy."

Hmmm, what an insightful statement.

thats what is going on



What about all the boys that only want to talk to the girls that they think they have a chance of getting in their pants?

Lets not GENERALIZE here?

thats not me at all, i believe you must truely love someone before you should have sex.




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: X-thirteen on 2002-09-28 21:39 ]</font>

Ziggy-san
Sep 29, 2002, 12:39 AM
Generalizing...those comments weren't meant to offend anyone at all...in fact, if there's anyone I meant to generalize it would be about 98.6% of the girls in my skool. I should have been more specific.

The other 3% are the kind of girls that are actually easy to talk to, and aren't cheerleaders (NO offence at all to any cheerleaders on this board o.0) and share similar interests with guys like me. And we're all friends. It's just so much easier that way. So screw love, is what I say.

Again, no offence to those that think differently. Just my two cents.

RuneLateralus
Sep 29, 2002, 12:54 AM
Well, a guy with my "success" can understand how you feel X-Thirteen, but is it the girl's fault? I would say no. But it is not your fault either. Unfortunatly, that is how it goes. There have been many (ok, 99% of the) girls I am attracted to or like, but I usually get turned down. Usually, it is because they are usually in a relationship and/or they do not have the same feelings for you.

Unfortunately, as much as it hurts, it is the way it is...of course this doesn't mean things may change in the future, as what feelings she might have at that time could always be different than they are now.

Abaddon
Sep 29, 2002, 02:01 AM
On 2002-09-28 22:39, Ziggy-san wrote:
Generalizing...those comments weren't meant to offend anyone at all...in fact, if there's anyone I meant to generalize it would be about 98.6% of the girls in my skool. I should have been more specific.

The other 3% are the kind of girls that are actually easy to talk to, and aren't cheerleaders (NO offence at all to any cheerleaders on this board o.0) and share similar interests with guys like me. And we're all friends. It's just so much easier that way. So screw love, is what I say.

Again, no offence to those that think differently. Just my two cents.



I want that hamster! <3<3<3

Ness
Sep 29, 2002, 09:28 AM
Hey X, I'm so sorry about what happened. I know where you're coming from because the girl I'm inlove with doesn't felle the same about me. The last girl tried to ask out told me never to talk to her again. So I can see why you are so depressed.

sai-lou-fu
Sep 29, 2002, 09:36 AM
heh, just get over it man, its only one girl, just be glad she told u know instead of months from now. why don't u just find the guy she's goin out with and kick his ass, thats if u can, that will make u feel better http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Ness
Sep 29, 2002, 09:42 AM
On 2002-09-29 07:36, sai-lou-fu wrote:
heh, just get over it man, its only one girl, just be glad she told u know instead of months from now. why don't u just find the guy she's goin out with and kick his ass, thats if u can, that will make u feel better http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



If he kicked his ass then the girl would hate him for sure.

theNightwisp
Sep 29, 2002, 02:56 PM
X, i almost did the same thing to a guy once, but if a girl has any consideration for a guy, she wouldn't do that. but what if you met someone and fell absolutely madly in love with them (seriously, not lust) and then they moved across the state, and completely forgot about you and refused to talk to you??? T_T anyone have advice?

ABDUR101
Sep 29, 2002, 03:21 PM
On 2002-09-29 12:56, theNightwisp wrote:
but what if you met someone and fell absolutely madly in love with them (seriously, not lust) and then they moved across the state, and completely forgot about you and refused to talk to you??? T_T anyone have advice?


If they refuse to talk to you and entirely forgot about you, it means it's a one sided love =

Thats about the most painful love there is, where you'd devote your entire life and soul to someone you love them so much and yet they barely even notice you're there.

Trust me, pull yourself away from it, or depression is going to be your best friend for a long time.

Been there, done that =

Ness
Sep 29, 2002, 06:37 PM
Even Abdur has a soft side. I guess we all do.

Sojo
Sep 29, 2002, 07:08 PM
My girlfriend has been asked out many times...

All the guys want is a shag...

They try to impress her more buy flashing money and buying things from her shop. Just shows how shallow they really are...

Men and wimmen can both be arseholes.

theNightwisp
Sep 29, 2002, 07:35 PM
thank you abdur, that's sound advice. you really seem to understand the situation. i have reason to believe that his parents may be involved with his lack of communication. i don't think him capable of just turning off what he once felt towards me. he's just not that kind of person. if he pm's me, tho, i'll keep you posted. (i'm assuming you care)

ABDUR101
Sep 29, 2002, 07:49 PM
Yeah, let us know how it turns out. I've been through it, and it's not good at all.

You start feeling like it's maybe your fault, you did something wrong, then you think of ways to make it better...bad cycle, and not even worth it.

Sion
Sep 30, 2002, 12:56 PM
this is why i do not fall in love.... girls are just to hard... i rather be with friends...that them... sides friends are more fun xD a GF just wants you to do what they want...which is usually something not fun for you

but oh well too bad x... but don't worry the "right girl" is still out there..hopefully for all of us...

i usually listen to music to get hopes up, songs i recomend are "riddlin kids - I feel fine" and "new found glory - My friends over you" those are good http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Ziggy-san
Sep 30, 2002, 09:41 PM
On 2002-09-30 10:56, Sion wrote:
this is why i do not fall in love.... girls are just to hard... i rather be with friends...that them... sides friends are more fun xD a GF just wants you to do what they want...which is usually something not fun for you

but oh well too bad x... but don't worry the "right girl" is still out there..hopefully for all of us...

i usually listen to music to get hopes up, songs i recomend are "riddlin kids - I feel fine" and "new found glory - My friends over you" those are good :P


*gives Sion 50 dollars*

X-thirteen
Sep 30, 2002, 09:51 PM
ok yesterday we talked for about 20 mins, and i asked some serious questions.. the main one being "why do you think it wouldnt work out if we were together?"... her answer was "i dont know.... it would be weird" then i said "but has anything weird ever happened in between us?.. how do you think things would get weird?", her answer was still "i dont know"...
i feel as if she is holding something back from me? anyone want to give there thoughts?

ABDUR101
Sep 30, 2002, 09:54 PM
If she's unsure, she's unsure.

If she feels uncomfortable, you can't really push her to say something she doesn't mean.

If she does feel something for you, she'll say it on her own because she'll want to say it, not before she's ready and sure on her own.

Don't rush =)

haterade
Sep 30, 2002, 11:01 PM
Dammit, X, just go out and look for someone yourself/get laid. You'll most likely feel better AND piss her off in the process, as she did you. Revenge can feel great, y'know. No girl is worth making you feel like dying. There's plenty more women out there that you can turn around and bump into someone that was 10 times better than who you're feeling sick over...besides, love is so damn near non-existant nowadays that there's no point in going out to look for it... I swear it's like a fuckin' myth...

Sure, consider me insensitive... you should really be calling me realistic. It's not all that hard to get a girl, and it definately doesn't take money to get one, to my knowledge. Clever words do wonders, man http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Just go out somewhere, and look for something that catches your eye. If you speak to her and things go well, there's a good chance you'll foget about this bullshit depression over some broad.

Guy - girl, shouldn't = heartbroken, depressed male

It should be like this: Guy - Girl = Guy's realization that there's plenty more, and girls come and go, plus guy's motivation to get something new

Smile http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Ness
Oct 1, 2002, 09:18 PM
On 2002-09-30 21:01, haterade wrote:
Dammit, X, just go out and look for someone yourself/get laid. You'll most likely feel better AND piss her off in the process, as she did you. Revenge can feel great, y'know. No girl is worth making you feel like dying. There's plenty more women out there that you can turn around and bump into someone that was 10 times better than who you're feeling sick over...besides, love is so damn near non-existant nowadays that there's no point in going out to look for it... I swear it's like a fuckin' myth...

Sure, consider me insensitive... you should really be calling me realistic. It's not all that hard to get a girl, and it definately doesn't take money to get one, to my knowledge. Clever words do wonders, man http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Just go out somewhere, and look for something that catches your eye. If you speak to her and things go well, there's a good chance you'll foget about this bullshit depression over some broad.

Guy - girl, shouldn't = heartbroken, depressed male

It should be like this: Guy - Girl = Guy's realization that there's plenty more, and girls come and go, plus guy's motivation to get something new

Smile http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif



That was one of the most blunt and insensitive things I've ever heard. Yet true. That's the smartest thing I've ever heard you say.

LostHero
Oct 2, 2002, 04:25 AM
Boo mother fucking hoo X-thirteen.

Mazarin
Oct 2, 2002, 04:58 AM
I had the same thing happen to me @ my senior prom. I had the girl I was falling(fallen) for over the past month and a half(and her doing the female signs of "I like you" w/ the touching, frequent hugging, and other things) tell me she was madly in love w/ her best friend(and vice-versa) durring the 2nd slow song of the nite. She proceeded to tell me she was a witch, druggy, and other things to try to "suddenly" deter my interest.

I found out the next day @ an outdoor concert that she was really a witch(she controlled the wind. No joke.) and I also found out her best friend that she was "madly in love" with, was FLAMINGLY gay(and thought I was cute, if that were to console me further)

Things you don't know about now, may save your ass in the end. If I were to get w/ this chick, I'd have gone insane! Yeah, it sucked that I found all this out, and it happened again w/ my recently dissolved 3.5 year relationship w/ my ex over lies, and personal insults. If I knew then what I know now, I'd have never forefited my friendship w/ her.

And now I'm back to square one.

I gotta get my Manwhore-ways back into action. 3 years gets you a tad rusty http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

It's tough, but go after something else.

Or get her drunk.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Mazarin on 2002-10-02 03:00 ]</font>