How is the new class system beta players?

[Turks68]

I read in the class selection portion how you level up based on how you play. In PSO you picked your class while creating your character. I guess you don't in PSU. Are the Beta players fining it hard or easy to become the type of class you would like to be?

[oShojino]

The only put back for me so far is that I cant use magice while in the HU type setting. Other than that its been great, really easy to change although a bit pricey

[_Tek_]

Yeah, instead of classes, you select a mode to level, so you could play all 3 equally.

But I assume there's no way to max all 3. It may be like the way mags in pso were.

[SgtSassafras]

I would like someone who actually has beta to give us a straight answer on this, some of whats been floating around on these forums appears illogical.

Ok, so You have a character level, and a seperate class level (either force, hunter, ranger). The character level changes and never goes down, your class level only increases if you are set as that class at that time. This all sounds fine, here is where the problem comes.

People claim that class levels dont effect one another. So if I am a lvl 5 hunter and lvl 10 force, when I am in force mode, I get none of the benefits. This can't be, just think about this for a moment. There would be NO purpose in leveling a seperate class. Instead of being a lvl 30 with a force level of 10, I could have had a force level of 15! That would actually increase my characters strength.

From what people are stating, the system in use adds no versatility or refinement to your character. It's completely useless. Someone please tell me (who has beta), whats going on here.

[Violation]

^My thoughts exactly...

But maybe just maybe, its purpose is for you to be able to max out all 3 classes. I mean thats the only logical reason I can think of. Like you said, everything I have read is quite illogical

[_Tek_]

The reason we just post, is because we got PSU on the brain. That's why I post lots, but then I only know a fraction of anything.

Perhaps as you level, all 3 modes level with you, instead of leveling each mode individually.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: _Tek_ on 2006-04-26 19:13 ]</font>

[Ryna]

The point of the system is diversity. If you don't want to put all of your effort into being a force, you can be something else for a while. Sure, you'd probably be better off focusing on one job, but that maybe boring for some people.

[RoninJoku]

Ever play PSO until about 150+ as a character then suddenly just get bored of doing the same thing over and over? Or you need a FO for your group, but no one has one high enough level? Or you just want to make another class but don't wanna level another character all the way to Ultimate? Well this system will help out in all of those situations! I like it alot! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[_Tek_]

the ability to send items to yourother characters inventories also helps. Since now you can use all types of weapons.

In pso, you could be a FO finding all sorts of rare swords, but they were totally usless to your FO.

[SgtSassafras]

The point of the system is diversity. If you don't want to put all of your effort into being a force, you can be something else for a while. Sure, you'd probably be better off focusing on one job, but that maybe boring for some people.

I do understand that, but why would I do it on the same character. Instead of having a gimped character that is lvl 2 at every job instead of level 6 at one, why not just make a completely new character to play a hunter, or a new one to play ranger? If the system really wanted to achieve diversity, your success in one class would always affect your character.

I'm hoping at some level a sub-class syste, comes into play, otherwise this game is exactly like PSO class system, but just in disguise.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SgtSassafras on 2006-04-26 19:38 ]</font>

[_Tek_]

All will be explained when the guides come out.

Which I'll need for my Partner machine.

[physic]

yea, i was wondering that as well some times it seems there is no advantage to leveling another job with the same charachter. One tester mentioned being able to use some weapons, but I dont know if he was speaking from experience or just thinking it might be so.

[Skorpius]

If the level of your other classes has an influence over the types of weapons you can equip, then it would be a.. pretty interesting system.

For example, if I'm leveling my Hunter class, I could use.. say, a certain type of cane because my Force class is leveled up to a point where the skills of a Force are bled through.

We also have to remember that this is the beta of the first version. You never know what kind of updates might come up further down the road.

[Goken]

So far what I've noticed is that from more usage of a certain weapon, my skill in that area increased, like my gun skill was only C, until I started camping like mad, I'm guessing that until I increase the gun skill, I won't be able to use dual handguns.

My example is like sabers, my saber skill is B, and I just managed to get dual sabers. And from what else I can tell, some of my "ranger" skills went up even when I was in HU mode, but I can't confirm this until later.

I hope this clears up "some" things, If not, feel free to ask and I'll take a look around.

[_Tek_]

Now please, tell us what happens to your weapon skills when you switch modes, after leveling some. Like say you played with saber in hu mode the whole time. And rechcked the stats in FO mode, would they be as if you were a fresh character starting as a FO?


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: _Tek_ on 2006-04-26 23:18 ]</font>

[butzopower]

Your weapons skills change when you change classes.

This lack of diversity is exactly why I think there will be more than 3 classes.

Also, the reason the mag example doesn't work, is that you could change your mag if you didn't like it. If you had maxes, then leveling your class would probably be permanant and would instead limit your customization.

As far as I can tell, there's no benefit to being lower in a class, although maybe it will actually be something good?

I don't see what's so lacking about the diversity in PSO. Somelike like Diablo 2 has diversity in what skills you level up, whereas something like PSO has diversity in what type of weapon you are using, since weapon types are completely different. Those are the two types of dungeon crawlers.

[Goken]

Ok I was slightly mistaken last night, after checking again today, as butzo states its exactly that skills change only when leveling up said class, or switching classes.

Also, I wouldn't doubt that there's a possibility that maybe having X levelled classes, might boost some weapon skill (maybe some mixture in between) although it doesn't seem like its possible right now.

Also, has anyone managed to switch to RA/FO and level that up yet? Its taking me forever just to level up this HU class alone... http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

[Tycho]

On 2006-04-26 19:49, Skorpius wrote:
For example, if I'm leveling my Hunter class, I could use.. say, a certain type of cane because my Force class is leveled up to a point where the skills of a Force are bled through.
It's one or the other. When you're a FO, you're not a HU. :/

[PJ]

Speaking of starting a new character rather than switching classes, how many characters can beta people make?

Also, when you change your class, is the EXP to level up the class on the level of the class, or the level of the character? (Uh, confusing wording)

[Turks68]

Thats exactly what I was wondering _TEK_. If you switch modes does it affect your stats? It would be cool if the stats somehowstay so that you can have a HU with the ability to use some high power FO weapons but this kind of defeats the point of picking a class. I don't know, I have faith in ST in making the right decision and I'm sure we will all enjoy it or get used to it regardless

[Nisshoku]

The max characters you can create is four, just like everything in Episode 1&2 onward.

[Rubesahl]

On 2006-04-26 19:25, RurouniJoku wrote:
Ever play PSO until about 150+ as a character then suddenly just get bored of doing the same thing over and over? Or you need a FO for your group, but no one has one high enough level? Or you just want to make another class but don't wanna level another character all the way to Ultimate? Well this system will help out in all of those situations! I like it alot! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif



Yep, also similar to FFXI too >_>; and in FFXI you do not get the benefits of the other job either.

I honestly don't see the problem with this >_> it just gives you chances to try out all the possibilities even if you picked a certain class in the beginning. It just makes everyone special. Besides fighters don't lack special moves like in PSO, they will have photon arts which will compensate when you think about it.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Rubesahl on 2006-04-27 06:40 ]</font>

[Ryudo]

the difference being that games like FF11 have dozens of classes as well as 5 races

if this is really the way the system works then PSU has only 3 character classes, which is frankly pathetic for a MMORPG and a step BACKWARD from PSO -_-

It's either:

A: you can be a Hunter, Force or Ranger and that's it, race will effect stats minorly but being a HUnewearl/Hunewm/HUmar/HUmarl/HUcast/HUcaseal will just make you a weak hunter compared to a HUbeast. Compared to PSO classes are basically HUcast, RAcast and FOnewearl style, except even back then FOnewearls could melee

OR

B. You can level all your class types and make unique characters based on the strengths of your race
HU/FO newearls like PSO HUnewearls, RA/FO humans RAmarl style and so on and so forth

I know which one of those sounds better, I'd like to think sega does too

[SgtSassafras]

Yep, also similar to FFXI too >_>; and in FFXI you do not get the benefits of the other job either.

I honestly don't see the problem with this >_> it just gives you chances to try out all the possibilities even if you picked a certain class in the beginning. It just makes everyone special. Besides fighters don't lack special moves like in PSO, they will have photon arts which will compensate when you think about it.

No, this isn't like Final Fantasy Xi at all... In that game you could subclass one of your other raised jobs, so i DID affect your character. Supposedly nothing like that exists in PSU, so its completely worthless.

[RoninJoku]

Is it at all possible that it actually could be like FFXI? In that after you reach a certain level (or maybe job level) you might be able to tack on another class that would maybe lower your main class stats and increase your secondary class stats as well as adding equipable weapon classes... so that you would become more of a hybrid.

As long as we are comparing to FFXI, in that game you had to actually reach a certain level before you could use a subclass, so perhaps a similar system could be employed for PSU...

I know there is no evidence of such a system in PSU, but there is also no evidence yet that there isn't... Anyhoosh... Just speculating the possibilities...

[Sev]

On 2006-04-27 08:54, SgtSassafras wrote:
[quote]
No, this isn't like Final Fantasy Xi at all... In that game you could subclass one of your other raised jobs, so i DID affect your character. Supposedly nothing like that exists in PSU, so its completely worthless.


Your right, this isn't like FFXI at all. Mostly because, it's not FFXI. Even in that game, your sub was half of the level of your main job... In PSU, you don't have a main job. This is the main difference. Also, for the 80,000th time PSU is not an MMORPG. That's not important though.

I haven't heard anything about ST providing any more then 4 character slots. That's most likely why they give you the choice to create 1 character of all 4 races and try out every job with that character. It makes sense, and it's alot easier then buying a second account in order to get access to more character slots. In order to change your job, you have to purchase a License. From a story sense, it's best to just say... Without a certain license, your restricted from the use of certain weapons and skills, or to increase in the aspects of one job, you have no choice but to decrease in the aspects of another job. It's not like that's anything concrete though, just a thought.

Really, I would've liked to be able to choose where my points went as well. This seems like the easiest way to balance out the game though. It keeps there from being tons of HU's with just enough FO skills to use high level support magic on themselves and then go into fights. It also promotes teamwork. Especially since in order to complete missions and get a good amount of points, you gotta do it right and you have to do it with as little deaths as possible.

It's still too early to say what's possible and what's not possible. We'll get a good bit of information on how things work from the Beta as more information is available.

[SgtSassafras]

Your right, this isn't like FFXI at all. Mostly because, it's not FFXI. Even in that game, your sub was half of the level of your main job... In PSU, you don't have a main job. This is the main difference. Also, for the 80,000th time PSU is not an MMORPG. That's not important though.

You really had no main job in FFXI either, you could level as many classes as you desire, and chose any job/subjob combination you wanted, nothing was set. PSU is an MMORPG. How could you possibly say its not. Massive Multi-player Online Roleplaying Game. How does this not fit? If guild wars and Dungeons and Dragons Online qualifies, so does PSU.

FFXI sucked anyway. A player should be given more than two choices in deciding the customization of their character. Thats all you had in FFXI, picking a Job and Subjob, and only a handful of combinations worked well for each job. The game was bad, lets give PSU some higher standards.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SgtSassafras on 2006-04-27 11:21 ]</font>

[physic]

uh... mmorpg refers to having a continous world in which there are a massive amount of players interacting in teh same world at the same time. like in ffxi 2000 people existed in teh same place. PSU is an orpg because you only have 6 people interacting in one world at a time.
anyhow thats no really important, and yeah you can hate FFXI, but you have way more choices in customizing your job than currently in psu. they had like what 15-18jobs? and 15-18 possible subjobs
so yeah you can not like ffxi, but comparing ffxi options for jobs versus psu is a pretty poor comparison.
I really hope reason for having multi jobs because if there isnt, liek some one mentioned every hunter may as well be a beast, and every fo may as well be a numan etc and ever ranger a cast. Whats the use of having a human who is good at everything if he can only use one ability at a time. before humans had magic and attack stats, so teh fact they werent the strongest suggested a different play style, but now it seems to be they have teh same limitations as a hucast with lower stats, no reason to be a human execpt for looks then. it doesnt make much sense really

[Sev]

I've been playing FFXI for a few years now...

You have the main job you are leveling, and your sub job. The sub job can only be half the level of your main job. The sub job did effect some of your stats such as STR, DEX, etc... But the main purpose of a sub job is the abilities and traits of that sub job. Anyway... That's not important.

What I'm trying to say is... If you can have a sub class on PSU you would basically have 3 levels. Your main character level. Your main job level. And your sub level of your secondary job. That's... A bit much. But who knows what they'll do. FFXI has somewhere around 15 jobs right now I think, I don't feel like counting them in my head so we'll go with that.

Right now... We don't know if you can possibly use magic on other jobs at a later time or not. It hasn't been specified and no ones high enough to know. We basically still have alot of things to figure out. The reason for being a race, is having different stats. For instance, although a Beast will have the best Hunter Stats, won't they still not be as great with a gun as a different Hunter? These are the differences in Races. Humans really have no weak point, but they aren't the strongest in any particular area. Whether it makes sense or not is up to the person. If you can only have 4 characters per account, you can make 1 character of each race and you can use other jobs with that race. Humans will have the easiest time leveling up all jobs because although they aren't the best, they aren't the worst in one area. That makes sense to me. As for the rest of it though, your pretty much correct. That doesn't mean they'll do it though, and even if not I'm gonna enjoy myself anyway because I don't particularly care about being the strongest. It's more of a team based game now afterall.

[SgtSassafras]

uh... mmorpg refers to having a continous world in which there are a massive amount of players interacting in teh same world at the same time. like in ffxi 2000 people existed in teh same place. PSU is an orpg because you only have 6 people interacting in one world at a time.

Uh... ever hear of Dungeons and Dragons online? Thats your definition, not an official definition. Any game that involves thousands of players interacting is an mmo. Of course you only fight in a 6 man or so party in PSU, in a zone where only your party affects the surroundings, but last time I checked thats the same exact thing WoW does, and no one denies thats an MMORPG. PSU uses an instance based system identical to DDO.

[Sev]

Yeah, the difference is probably that PSO has always used this type of sytem and was never classified as an MMORPG before. That might be due to the fact that it's an Action RPG and not the tradition macro hitting menu selecting type for attacks? If PSU is an MMO, then well... PSO sorta was too. Plus, although things are instanced the fact that you have a world to actually explore does change things. In both PSO and PSU you don't have the complete freedom to move around as you do in other games like WoW, D&D online, EQ, CoH, FFXI. So that could also be a reason why it's not really considered an MMORPG by most people.

[fumatanera]

i asked this in another thread and it was never answered, maybe someone can answer it now. as you level you char (not class) your base stats are increased, correct? so say you got you char to level 35 or so before trying to level another class (say you were FO and changed to ranger). wouldn't that make your stats as the lvl 1 Ranger higher than someone who is char level 5 and began as a Ranger at the same time. wouldn't you be a ranger with higher magic stats?

[physic]

massive multiplayer online role playing game, i guess you can interpret that how you want really, depends what massive means to you.

[Sev]

On 2006-04-27 13:05, fumatanera wrote:
i asked this in another thread and it was never answered, maybe someone can answer it now. as you level you char (not class) your base stats are increased, correct? so say you got you char to level 35 or so before trying to level another class (say you were FO and changed to ranger). wouldn't that make your stats as the lvl 1 Ranger higher than someone who is char level 5 and began as a Ranger at the same time. wouldn't you be a ranger with higher magic stats?



You would have higher stats period. As long as your level 30, and they're level 5, your stats are most likely gonna be higher then there. Even there RA stats because your base stats will change to match RA stats. You'd have higher magical skill, but it wouldn't be skill that carried over from being a FO. That's how it seems at least.

[Shiwayari]

From what I understand it's like this now:

Your char has a "base" lvl which will never change even if you change class and a "job" lvl that changes if you change you class. Right?

Then there is this other system which was that when you use ranged attacks your ranger stats rise, when you use close attacks then your hunter stats rise and so on.

Now how do those two systems work together, or was the latter one abandoned?
And how does "job" lvl effect the char? Do your stats rise or will you only be able to equip stronger weps?


And also I'm confused about who can use spells. When you are Hunter or Ranger, I guess you can't equip canes and such.
That means either spells have to able to be bound to hunter, ranger weapons or you can't even use lvl 1 spells with hunter, ranger. Which one is it?

[Oji_Retta]

Ooh...uhhh..*holds head* I have a headache. It is partly do to me getting confused on this class issue since everytime I look, there is another question and another answer that goes against another answer. The other reason is that I've been blasting Gangsta Rap on my speakers. *Thanks 47 Miller Gang for the hot track* (There's a little hood in all of us...at least in me)



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Oji_Retta on 2006-04-27 14:42 ]</font>

[SgtSassafras]

Your char has a "base" lvl which will never change even if you change class and a "job" lvl that changes if you change you class. Right?

Then there is this other system which was that when you use ranged attacks your ranger stats rise, when you use close attacks then your hunter stats rise and so on.

I wish they would have just used a system like Oblivion. Your character has the ability to do everything, your skills increase depending on which ones you use the most. That way the growth would feel more natural, no abrupt interuption in playstyle when you switch to a different class to level that up.

Something positive came to me about this today. Like i have said throughout this entire thread, the system as is seems pointless, and that's surely true. What I am hoping is that in reality, you classes will affect one another. A lvl 5 ranger, lvl 5 force will be a combination of both, and that the mode you pick will only determine which will gain experience at that given time. I'm starting to believe that the ability for jobs to combine and affect one another just isnt included in the beta content. That kinda of stuff can honestly be tested internally, beta tests are basically for server stability and glitches.

[RoninJoku]

@whoever compared WoW's instance system to PSO's party system... WoW NEEDS those instance situations because of the PVP aspect... You couldn't be crawling through a dungeon, about to fight a boss, and then suddenly an opposing faction trotts in and wipes your party just for fun.. that doesn't work... But WoW also has an overworld where you can interact with people not on your party... making WoW an MMORPG... PSO/PSU = MORP

[DizzyDi]

Yeah I read through this whole topic and that problem still hasn't been answered.
Can you mix and match jobs?
If I were to put 5 into FO and 5 into HU can I go into a dungeon with the skills from both a lvl 5 FO and a lvl 5 HU or would I have to choose between the two?

[Ryna]

On 2006-04-27 15:54, DizzyDi wrote:
Can you mix and match jobs?
If I were to put 5 into FO and 5 into HU can I go into a dungeon with the skills from both a lvl 5 FO and a lvl 5 HU or would I have to choose between the two?


From what I've seen, you'll have to choose between the two.

[DizzyDi]

Yeah then the system really is redundant and makes no sense. It just defeated the whole purpose of itself. You're sopposed to be able to have a mixed bag of skills if you wanted to, instead of being stuck with just one class. Yeah I know you can switch while not in a mission but it still just doesn't make sense to level more than one class up. I was looking foward to making a Newman with HU and FO skills but now I gotta choose which one he has to be every mission? Thats no fun.

[SgtSassafras]

whoever compared WoW's instance system to PSO's party system... WoW NEEDS those instance situations because of the PVP aspect... You couldn't be crawling through a dungeon, about to fight a boss, and then suddenly an opposing faction trotts in and wipes your party just for fun.. that doesn't work...

Ever hear of Dark Ages of Camelot? That would happen often in the high level dungeon there, and it really wasnt a problem. WoW uses an instance system more because of the fact that a given instance might have 30 groups running it at once. 30 groups in one instance at the same time with all the mobs would end up crashing the server.

[mechatra]

From what we've seen the FO class seems to actually benefit mostly from being able to mix and match.

They can equip canes and rods for casting (which other classes can't)
They can use pistols and bows
And they can also use sabers spears daggers and dual daggers.

hmmm.....