PM raising unbalanced? Hell yeah!

[Xx3of19xX]

The only real grievence I have about PSU so far is how unbalanced raising of PMs is. Raising any other attribute than striking in particular. So for striking I can just dump tons of monomates and other foods in it that are a dime a dozen maybe a melee weapon every once in a while if I want the max amount of striking, but for Dex I need to feed it expensive guns, for TECH expensive TECH disks or Force weaps and for Armor expensive armor. WTF?!

[Guilty-Mirage]

Maybe they're doing it because Hunters make up like 3/4ths of the population and thus there need to be enough Striker PMs to keep supply up with the demand? >_>

[Diablohead]

You will realise that the harder to make stuff will sell for more later on in the game. thats one advantage.

And a more unique looking pm.

[CypherErebus]

U don't have to giv it tech discs for tech to raise or armor for dex. Diff items do it better. Check PSUPEDIA.org

[Kuya]

Just a quick note - there isn't DEX anymore right? It's ranged right? And to raise that, feed it traps. 100 meseta traps raise it +6 to the ranged stat. Fairly cheaper than synthing guns or any other method http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Itsuki]

hes complaining too much. The only thing thats expensive to raise is mind. And infact, ranged is the cheapest of all of them.

[xJermariox]

So how do you raise up B.Str ( i think thats what its called) My PM evolved and its still on 0. Does it go up randomly are what?

[Guilty-Mirage]

Technically, all PMs are free to raise to 100.

If you really want to spend that much time doing nothing but raising one.

[Cross]

On 2006-10-30 05:54, Guilty-Mirage wrote:
Technically, all PMs are free to raise to 100.

If you really want to spend that much time doing nothing but raising one.


The only stat that you can raise in a reasonable timeframe by recreating characters is Armour, due to the fact that you get three 2* items and one 1* item, which ends up being 24 or 30 Armour per character (depending on whether you make a Cast or a Fleshy). You can get some points from the other equipment they have, but it's only incidental, really.

The easiest stats to raise are Armour and Ranged.
Armour is easy as hell if you recreate characters (and is also the fastest at 15 levels per day, if you use Casts), and so much of a pain in the ass if you don't that it isn't really worth considering.

Ranged costs only 20000 meseta a day, and you get 12 levels per day. That's basically two hours of farming, give or take.

Striking is technically the easiest to raise, since Moon Atomizers are cheap and kick ass, but that's not what you want to do if you're crafting, because you end up with only 75 Striking and 25 Technic, which is a pretty worthless spread.
To offset the Technic you need to feed it three 1* weapons for every Moon Atomizer, which both reduces the time it takes to 12 levels/day, and increases the cost enormously to 44500 meseta/day.

Technic is the most annoying. Either you get the "cheap" way of feeding it 1* Wands and get 8 levels per day at a cost of 36000 meseta per day, or you use 1* tech discs at the standard rate of 12 levels per day, and it costs you 100000 meseta per day. Past that, it just gets more and more expensive and you get less and less return on your investment.

[Cross]

The item isn't in the game yet as far as I know, and likely won't be in until we get the Expert Type update from the JP servers.

[Xx3of19xX]

On 2006-10-30 05:27, Kuya wrote:
Just a quick note - there isn't DEX anymore right? It's ranged right? And to raise that, feed it traps. 100 meseta traps raise it +6 to the ranged stat. Fairly cheaper than synthing guns or any other method http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif


Yeah but how many traps do you find lying around as drops compared to anti, mono, di, and trimates and sol/staratomizers and food and buff items?

Regardless of any cheats you can use (recreating chars over and over and over) it is still pretty unbalanced and I wish there was more diversity in what stats items raised.
Weapons raise the associated attribute, same for disks, traps are a ranger item, so them raising range makes sense as well. But then why do ALL foods/restoratives and buffs raise Striking primarily?

[Bast]

A bit off the topic (my apologies, I didn't want to make a new topic for this small question), does anyone know where I can obtain the item that resets my PM to level zero?

[Bast]

Thanks Cross.

[Monie]

You can buy traps for 100 meseta at the store.

[mananas]

I hate how all the food items you can make do the EXACT SAME THING... +lots of striking + a little mind. Every. Single. Rare. Food.

[Jiga]

Where are you making 20,000 meseta a day in 2 hours of farming?

[Cross]

A Force running through C-Rank Relics and a Ranger running through C-Rank Rainbow Beast (Shikon 2) both end up making an average of about 160-166 meseta/minute (watashiwa and I tested this in the JP version), and by that figure 20000 meseta is almost exactly 120 minutes.

Granted, those figured were tested when we were in our 30s, but it's actually not too much different from at 25 or so.

[Miphesto]

F*** ALL YOU HUNTER HATERS

[Jiga]

I'm 20, and I haven't seen those numbers yet... but I'll definitely try C-Rank Rainbow beast tonight.

[Ri0T]

Those temporary buff items seem to give a whole lot more than the usual mates/weapons/armor do. Most of them give about +10 Striking and +2 or so in another category. One of them (forgot which, sorry) gave a pretty high dose of Armor if I remember correctly.

While buying the synth ingredients i suppose it could be a little more expensive than you'd want, you can farm the ingredients. Of course, you have to have the boards as well. In my experience, i seem to get the items for the buff ingredients most frequently, and have found multiple boards.

[Skyly]

the game is very off balance with PMs. When I go into other people's shops, which is very frequently, I see people's PM at like lvl 25, with with like 20 striking and like 5 tech. I suppose you could just make you current PM a GH 41 (if thats the hunter 1) and synth hunter weapons, sell them in ur shop and basically save up for the force PM.

[Schubalts]

Buuut, unless you use that PM resetting item when it comes out, or use another character, you would be stuck with that hunter-type PM.

[Xx3of19xX]

Yeah it would be better if the food raised a single stat depending on the type of food.

For example:
Veggies: Striking
Drinks: Dex
Sweets: Mind
Meats: Armor.

[Xx3of19xX]

On 2006-10-30 09:39, Cross wrote:
A Force running through C-Rank Relics and a Ranger running through C-Rank Rainbow Beast (Shikon 2) both end up making an average of about 160-166 meseta/minute (watashiwa and I tested this in the JP version), and by that figure 20000 meseta is almost exactly 120 minutes.

Granted, those figured were tested when we were in our 30s, but it's actually not too much different from at 25 or so.


At what luck level? You get a lot more drops with lv 3 luck compared to lv 0.

[Diablohead]

I don't see psu as a game that needs to be rushed, if it takes 3 weeks to get a good PM them so be it. it will be totaly worth it in the end.

[Russ2576]

On 2006-10-30 10:08, sklyl wrote:
the game is very off balance with PMs. When I go into other people's shops, which is very frequently, I see people's PM at like lvl 25, with with like 20 striking and like 5 tech. I suppose you could just make you current PM a GH 41 (if thats the hunter 1) and synth hunter weapons, sell them in ur shop and basically save up for the force PM.



Sorry, OT, but, you can get different PMs? How?

[Randomness]

I'm just focusing on striking myself, since mind is by far too expensive for now.

Also, on a force, a striking PM would be plenty useful. I can resta myself. I'll make the mind one on an alt thats a hunter or ranger or something.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Randomness on 2006-10-30 16:21 ]</font>

[Russ2576]

On 2006-10-30 16:14, Russ2576 wrote:

On 2006-10-30 10:08, sklyl wrote:
the game is very off balance with PMs. When I go into other people's shops, which is very frequently, I see people's PM at like lvl 25, with with like 20 striking and like 5 tech. I suppose you could just make you current PM a GH 41 (if thats the hunter 1) and synth hunter weapons, sell them in ur shop and basically save up for the force PM.



Sorry, OT, but, you can get different PMs? How?



Sorry again, just really curious about this.

[Jiga]

I tried the 2nd account free ranger pm yesterday. This trick works wonders. Though you can only get 8 armor levels per feeding time, and only 4 ranged levels per feeding time. It's free but time consuming. I'll never add striking or tech again.

[Shazbot]

Yeah, 20,000 in 2 hours from Relics is a bit deceptive. Notice that nobody actually said they pulled down 20,000 in 2 hours. They likely did 1 run and divided the meseta gained by the time it took. It's easy to say, "2 hours of farming Relics and you'll have 20,000!" but super luck only lasts for the day and you should consider yourself very fortunate if your same character gets even 3 days of super luck per month, let alone 2.

Now consider that most people can't play straight for 24 hours--they have work, school, sleep, eating, normal everyday-people things to do. So don't be thinking, "You can just farm all day on super luck days anyway and get, like, ...uhmmm.....so much money that I can't even count that high!" because you can't. You're not a robot.

One Relics run with super luck nets my Lv. 30 Force about 2700-3000 meseta in 15 minutes. That's 8 Relics runs in 2 hours, 20000+ meseta, and real frickin' boring. Also, bear in mind that when doing repeated runs of anything you get sleepy, your bag gets filled up with stuff, you need something from the shop, whatever, the point is shit comes up. It'll probably take more like 3 hours and up. In theory, it sounds easy, in practice it's hard. It's a good way to make money, yeah, but just don't talk about it like, "you simply need to do this" and you'll be rich and raising your PM to 100 will be so fast and easy.

[Zato-2TWO]

For a cheap Mind PM, couldn't you just create a buttload of Newm mules and take their starting wands? It wouldn't be nearly as fast as tossing in 3 CAST-parts/clothes per mule, but it'd be a heck of a lot cheaper.

[lolichan]

what exactly would a 100% armor PM do? as in, nothing but armor levels to 100. does that do pretty much nothing but be able to make line shields with better success rate, or am i missing something? also what about clothes? clothes is sorta..armor.. :3

[Cross]

On 2006-11-01 02:22, Shazbot wrote:
Yeah, 20,000 in 2 hours from Relics is a bit deceptive. Notice that nobody actually said they pulled down 20,000 in 2 hours. They likely did 1 run and divided the meseta gained by the time it took. It's easy to say, "2 hours of farming Relics and you'll have 20,000!" but super luck only lasts for the day and you should consider yourself very fortunate if your same character gets even 3 days of super luck per month, let alone 2.

No no, I've done it. I didn't say it wasn't boring as hell but grinding is by its very nature boring, and that's not going to change. It doesn't take 3 Luck, either; I've done it at 0 as well as 3.
Granted, you do have to lose a few minutes here and there to stash your loot back in storage, but on the other hand, I was only counting the actual meseta that drops, and the small amount of meseta you get from selling worthless consumable and board items.
On the other hand, if you get, say, a Nanocarbon while running Sleeping Warriors, you can turn that right around and sell it for 2000 in a shop, which can come pretty close to doubling the cash you make on the entire run - Marselines are similar, easily sold for 1000 each.

The point is, 20000 meseta in a day is hardly a stretch if you're not a really busy person. You don't have to poopsock the game to get it - you just have to submit to the idea that you're going to be bored for quite a while. It's still shitty, but it's not unrealistic, especially since Sleeping Warriors is so simple to beat. At least using a Force, today I played it in the background while I watched House and Veronica Mars in a seperate window.

Technic PM raising, on the other hand, is a ridiculous grind. Getting 100000 meseta a day is definitely not the most pleasant way to play the game, and I wouldn't even bother trying that.


On 2006-11-01 02:32, lolichan wrote:
what exactly would a 100% armor PM do? as in, nothing but armor levels to 100. does that do pretty much nothing but be able to make line shields with better success rate, or am i missing something? also what about clothes? clothes is sorta..armor.. :3



Yeah, it only makes Armour, and also helps you out in combat (a 100 Armour PM becomes GH-440, the Shotgun one). I've got a pure Armour PM at level 45 right now. By Friday morning it's going to be combat-capable, and by Saturday night it's going to be maxed out.


On 2006-11-01 02:30, Zato-2TWO wrote:
For a cheap Mind PM, couldn't you just create a buttload of Newm mules and take their starting wands? It wouldn't be nearly as fast as tossing in 3 CAST-parts/clothes per mule, but it'd be a heck of a lot cheaper.



Technically you could, but honestly that's so ludicrously dull and tedious that I wouldn't reccommend it. For reference, if I'm doing the character recreation dance while I pay attention to something else, it can take well over 2 hours to get through 75 characters. To level a PM as fast as possible by recreating for Wands could easily take about three hours to get all 100 Wands you'd need and you'd have to do it twice a day to keep your PM fed as often as possible. I really, really can't see anybody having the patience to spend six hours daily doing that (well, the FFXI players might like it, but the less said there, the better).

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Cross on 2006-11-01 03:47 ]</font>

[Jiga]

Cross provides good info. I've had my doubts about the 20,000m in 2 hours. But making 2k in 15 minutes in Linear Line solo comes out to 16k in 2hours (yeah yeah minus the time you spend putting stuff in storage, selling, and prepping). The character recreation Armor PM is the fastest/cheapest growth rate i've seen so far.

[BigBadWolf]

I'm gonna have to agree with Shazbot on this, I've done Mission C relics plenty of times, and I'm currently Lv. 27 Newman Force and I don't make those figures. Among all the previous times variables to consider, you also have to factor in the costs of having to recharge the weapons, which reduces the the profits by that much more.

I'm not saying that Cross is lying, I'm sure you do get 20k in two hours of farming, but I can tell that with your level 45+ pure armor PM you're far from the average player. So there might be some other factors getting you that extra mesta per hour that the rest of us don't have access to.

In my experience 6-7k per hour if you don't sell your drops in Sleeping Warriors is more believable. I do agree though that, the mission is the best for farming purposes (and possibly mission points?).

[Tygrus]

On 2006-11-01 02:22, Shazbot wrote:
Yeah, 20,000 in 2 hours from Relics is a bit deceptive. Notice that nobody actually said they pulled down 20,000 in 2 hours. They likely did 1 run and divided the meseta gained by the time it took. It's easy to say, "2 hours of farming Relics and you'll have 20,000!" but super luck only lasts for the day and you should consider yourself very fortunate if your same character gets even 3 days of super luck per month, let alone 2.

Now consider that most people can't play straight for 24 hours--they have work, school, sleep, eating, normal everyday-people things to do. So don't be thinking, "You can just farm all day on super luck days anyway and get, like, ...uhmmm.....so much money that I can't even count that high!" because you can't. You're not a robot.

One Relics run with super luck nets my Lv. 30 Force about 2700-3000 meseta in 15 minutes. That's 8 Relics runs in 2 hours, 20000+ meseta, and real frickin' boring. Also, bear in mind that when doing repeated runs of anything you get sleepy, your bag gets filled up with stuff, you need something from the shop, whatever, the point is shit comes up. It'll probably take more like 3 hours and up. In theory, it sounds easy, in practice it's hard. It's a good way to make money, yeah, but just don't talk about it like, "you simply need to do this" and you'll be rich and raising your PM to 100 will be so fast and easy.



Was this on B rank?