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pixelate
Nov 19, 2002, 03:18 AM
...I'm lazy, and being a mod means working. Bleh.

Ok, but seriously now. As the site currently stands, what's wrong with it? Apparently it's so messed up that people feel a need to bash it from other sites. Instead of complaining at some other safe haven, let us know by venting in this thread; that way, we'll have a better idea about what we should be focused on.

It's almost like not voting during elections. If you don't vote, you can't complain. If you don't vent in this thread, you can't complain.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: pixelate on 2002-11-21 16:27 ]</font>

RuneLateralus
Nov 19, 2002, 03:57 AM
Wow, you too Pixel? I thought I was the only one that was lazy... http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Ok, I am done with the cute stuff...now for the rarely seen serious side of me. Granted, I haven't been here as long as the other mods and members, but I seen a lot happen here, and all in all, this is a good site. I have made some good friends here and I am glad that I came here in the first place. I, too, am just curious to know why there is so much site bashing. At least this way we can learn how to make it more friendly.

This place is supposed to be a friendly community. We want to make it as friendly as possible.

RedFox
Nov 19, 2002, 04:30 AM
apart from miserable mods cough*RuneLateralus*cough the sites fine!! the best general PSO site out there http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

very happy customer here.

*awaits beating from RuneLateralus http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/twak.gif *

neko-chan
Nov 19, 2002, 05:05 AM
I think we should have more Aria Giovanni material here... such as Aria Giovanni HUnewearl skins, Aria Giovanni action figures, Aria Giovanni polls, Aria Giovanni galleries, Aria Giovanni section id, Aria Giovanni mag and Aria Giovanni mods.

So... more Aria Giovanni and less complaining.

LollipopLolita
Nov 19, 2002, 05:09 AM
Aria Giovanni mods?
how the hell are we gonna pull that one off?
erupt as Aria Giovanni?

neko-chan
Nov 19, 2002, 05:12 AM
Try to hire her. I know Asia Carrera writes for a computer mag... Aria could work here as a part time mod for a little money... Also, she would be really motivated if you let her know I'm posting here too!!!



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: neko-chan on 2002-11-19 03:07 ]</font>

BlackRose
Nov 19, 2002, 10:16 AM
You know, i'll bet most of the people who bash the site only visit the General forum.

I think the erupt-lolita-saladwood-pixelate posse is a little alienating sometimes, but hell... that's just an opinion. And it's nothing that's gonna outweigh all the perks of visiting here.

neko-chan
Nov 19, 2002, 10:30 AM
On 2002-11-19 07:16, BlackRose wrote:
lolita-saladwood-pixelate posse is a little


Just a little? (http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=33916&forum=6&9) >_>;;;

BlackRose
Nov 19, 2002, 12:52 PM
Yes, just a little. And that link is the mods doing their jobs, which I don't mind at all.

neko-chan
Nov 19, 2002, 12:58 PM
Wops... sorry BlackRose, I used your post as a hook to start a new complaint toward the mods.

LollipopLolita
Nov 19, 2002, 02:02 PM
*sniff* BlackRose forgot Abdur

jazzyfox
Nov 19, 2002, 02:05 PM
Because mistkerl is gone!

LollipopLolita
Nov 19, 2002, 02:07 PM
wow, then jazzy, you've been in angst for a long long time

pixelate
Nov 19, 2002, 03:09 PM
Hmm...a posse...I want a horse now... =(

Other than the link neko already posted as an example, I'd like to hear why it's thought of as an alienating posse (I don't want the mods to be alienating).

[Oops. I was in a rush to post. Got my -ing words confuzzled.]

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: pixelate on 2002-11-19 13:15 ]</font>

BlackRose
Nov 19, 2002, 03:37 PM
Well, by alienating I mean a situation like this:
I'd click on a thread, see a few posts, and think "meh, I don't wanna post on this..." and go view some other thread. I'd either ignore it until it dies or stomach it and post anyway.

Although, I'd say that it's not the moderator's job to try and please everyone... just to keep people in line.

[edit: I gotcha... no worries]

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: BlackRose on 2002-11-19 13:25 ]</font>

ABDUR101
Nov 19, 2002, 03:49 PM
I thought I just came here everyday to indirectly vent my hatred and angst towards all of my fellow mods with kindess...Dear God, I have been deceivethed!

I've been here for quite a while, I've seen quite alot of people come and go, and I've been in quite afew arguements with them(*), but that has no effect on my enjoyment of the site.

It's a massive community, and I'm just glad I can take part in it.

Oh and...the fact that people haven't mentioned me yet is astounding. I thought I was the mod that was supposed to get all the flak and hang by a thread =X

..I'm kidding. =)

*- Possibly prior to being a mod.


But come on people, for as much bashing as I've seen, where is everyone?! I hear no grammar remarks or how sucky our guides are, so I guess that was all angst right? Come on, come out with it or forever hold your peace. =D

We can't improve if you don't tell us what to improve upon.

Deathscythealpha
Nov 19, 2002, 06:10 PM
Well, i think people have only really been moaning about the apparent influx of Fanboys in recent weeks *was totally oblivious to this untill someone else ranted about it*.

I myself cant find any problem with the site as it is at the mniute, except it can be a bit tempremental at times *had loads of Error 504's or something last night*, but that cant be helped.



On 2002-11-19 12:49, ABDUR101 wrote:

Oh and...the fact that people haven't mentioned me yet is astounding. I thought I was the mod that was supposed to get all the flak and hang by a thread =X



Oh, to make Abdur happy. Its all Abdurs fault, hes evil and is bringing the site down. I suggest a mass burning of this evil mod. http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Nah, everythings fine.

LollipopLolita
Nov 19, 2002, 08:10 PM
burning abdur sounds good. yuummmm kebab

Sedric
Nov 19, 2002, 09:06 PM
Funny how many people complain at their "safe haven," but are afraid of filing and turning in the "official complaint form" here at PSOW.

Yessss..... they are afraid..... They know that the mods are...... kings and queens of this forum, and they run the show.

Some even fear that mods will skin them alive, eat & chew em to bits, spit em out, and feed em to Hounds-from-Hell(?) for complaining. Ooh, ghastly.....

Others are just being pure idiots. They just go around the globe and spread their "crusade" against PSOW, just for heck of it. You know, it's just like those people at Newgrounds.com who votes 0 out of 5 for every single flash movies for no apparent reason.

I believe there are remaining others with their own stupid reasons for doing that....

I think general population here are satisfied, if not happy, with what they see here. Though I can't guarantee for everyone, PSOW is a good forum.

It's not easy being mod. I know it. Just remember the old saying: you can't make everyone happy.

And we, as regular posters, should remember that mods are NOT perfect.

MikeRSG
Nov 20, 2002, 01:39 AM
I haven't heard these rumblings at all. In fact, my experience here has been strictly positive. Rune, Lolita, and Abdur particularly have all gone out of their way to say "hi" and make me feel welcome. The posts are mostly intelligent and I see much less of the console fanboys than I was bracing myself for when I signed up for my Hunter's License. All in all, a nice sense of community!

My only complaint is how slow the pages are to load. The server runs like ice-cold molasses. *ducks* http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

LollipopLolita
Nov 20, 2002, 01:55 AM
try turning off sigs, it helps a lot. and also please remember that we're on gamepsy servers, which is beyond our control. and please take into account the amount of people viewing the site at one time.

this is why we always stay away from images as much as possible in the forums.
^_^

thanks mike!

Neo-Zenji
Nov 20, 2002, 02:07 AM
People post the darnest things.

Shrevn
Nov 20, 2002, 03:20 AM
man.. let them talk shit... ill back ya up WHUT!
Where my gun at?!?!?!

But seriously.... Theres always going to be haters out there for everything. ask d55 one of the times that we were playing some kid said "you two from psow, you must be hackers that sites for hackers and cheaters" So like i said haters must hate but playas must play. >.<''

My only prob with the site is that... im not in the MAIN SCREEN AS KING!!! but itll happen someday... till then keep up the good work.

*hopes the mods like the wobba now!*

Balthor
Nov 20, 2002, 07:48 AM
You know what you guys need? Some gingerbread men.

LollipopLolita
Nov 20, 2002, 02:48 PM
http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/gingerbread.gif

DarthWufei
Nov 20, 2002, 03:55 PM
I don't like the elitist attitude some people here have, but it's not as bad as I thought it was at first.

Plus, I don't think PSOW can really do anything about people like that.

LostHero
Nov 21, 2002, 03:26 AM
PSOW is the best at what its for and what it does.
Can't complain about that can you?

In any case, I think this site needs more advertising, and if possible more porn star content as suggested.

Perhaps bi-weekly psow get togethers where we film our own amatuer pornos?

neko-chan
Nov 21, 2002, 04:52 AM
This is a dam good idea. What's better than some good action between SnAPPLE, Barubary and some other radom users?

Alisha
Nov 21, 2002, 05:26 AM
pso porn for the masses
http://flow-isode.com/Dios%20and%20Parn.JPG

Spy
Nov 21, 2002, 12:06 PM
I'd vent but I don't really want to see this topic locked and my response would be deleted anyways http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

One man with a shovel can't hold back the tide.

Danger_Girl
Nov 21, 2002, 04:09 PM
Vibe here is ugly sometimes, not always.

Mods/admin can take things kinda personally sometimes.

PSOSaladWood using CAPS in his/her posts is REALLY ANNOYING. Allcaps gives the sense that one is BEING SHOUTED at. Please don't shout, YOU need only to speak.

There is an 'us against them' feel here. This is exacerbated by the mods/admins ganging up in threads.

The posting of the easter lobbys and such don't bother me that much. I can choose not to look at them. Just so you are all aware that it is just a matter of time before the counsle crackers ruin the game as it was meant to be played. By dealing with one, you are condoning it. I'm sorry but that is the simple truth.

Those are a few of the complaints that come to the top of my head. There could be more, but those are chief among them.

Now

I think it would only be fair to mention some of the things I like about PSOW. I like the contests. I think they are a good idea. I might rip them from time to time, but only because I enjoy getting under the skin of you guys and gals so much.

I very much still enjoy the comunity. Its still the most honest, generally most mature group of people playing pso. I don't have to go to the lobby and suffer through torrents of profanity and pornographic symbol chats. I still feel I can trade without the use of the trade window when dealing with anyone I recognize as a poster here. Trust is valuable, and the good folks at PSOW have mine.

There...I think thats long winded enough.

neko-chan
Nov 21, 2002, 05:24 PM
On 2002-11-21 13:09, Danger_Girl wrote:
There is an 'us against them' feel here. This is exacerbated by the mods/admins ganging up in threads.


Yeah, and it's pathetic.

Ironically, liked more the watashiwa way: "I'm the boss here, I'm right while you aren't, so shut up".

At least he had a style. I think it's ridiculous mods always try to defend their own position gangin up like they did here (http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=32789&forum=11&start=10&17).

But so far, examples are endless. The saddest one? The Goth Gurl "affair".

Another thing I don't like is the site itself They're keeping adding contents, and thi is good, but these contents are stored inside the old PSOW "shell", and this is bad. It's a mess. It's an old layout that doesn't fit the new needs of the site.

And think also we have at least 3 mods involved in desing and Web stuff. Look eRUPT: every day he has time to fix things, add new features, etc... Probably he doesn't have so much time but he does a great job anyway.

I think "the other" mods should make an effort on re-designing and creating a new "envelope" for the great new contents. If not I think all the new stuff will just disappear behind the mess.

Oh! And fuck! It took me few months, few news and like 10 avatars to be credited as contributor, while Barubary just posted, for the first time, some contents and he immediately got credited. This is not fair!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: neko-chan on 2002-11-21 14:42 ]</font>

jazzyfox
Nov 21, 2002, 06:08 PM
On 2002-11-21 14:24, neko-chan wrote:
At least he had a style. I think it's ridiculous mods always try to defend their own position gangin up like they did here (http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=32789&forum=11&start=10&17).


It's a requirement to never disagree in public. Serious.

eRUPT
Nov 21, 2002, 06:40 PM
And think also we have at least 3 mods involved in desing and Web stuff. Look eRUPT: every day he has time to fix things, add new features, etc... Probably he doesn't have so much time but he does a great job anyway.


Look I code and help add content with the other admins and mods, they are the ones that do the majority of all the work, I simply help them add their content to the site. Lolita, SaladWood, rbf2000 are definetly some to be noted as mods having provided large amounts of content to the site and all be it they do not get the credit they really do deserve all the new content you see added HAS to be credited to them. Especially Lolita who gets tons and tons of new images and content prepared which I simply just help put up on the site for her.

Really your missing out on what they are all doing if you think at all that I deserve any type of sole credit then your very wrong. All the contest ideas, new features and such was all brought by our admins, like I said I just help them implement their ideas.

pixelate
Nov 21, 2002, 07:05 PM
The thing about the mods ganging up on people. Yes, it may look like we only comment on certain issues, but those issue do need all staff to have an opinion and to voice that opinion. If we didn't voice our opinion as staff, we wouldn't be doing our job. If it's the way we're voicing our opinions, then I can understand how that can be a problem; if that is the problem, please let us know when we're doing it and in what manner. We can't fix things for the better if we don't know what's broken.

As far as working on the site. Not everyone on staff has knowledge in HTML, PHP, or databases. So not every staff member can contribute as much as others. Some people just don't bring in enough of a paycheck to get the necessary things for screenshots. Not everyone has enough time to learn how to use HTML, PHP, or databases. And for the staffers that don't know contribute these things, they contribute in other ways with their ideas and modding.

If you wonder who's doing what behind the scenes, just ask.

And don't forget, just because you're not on staff, that doesn't mean you cannot contribute in other ways. For instance, members can write FAQs, editorials, guides, make banners, avatars, AIM icons, and a load of other things.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: pixelate on 2002-11-21 16:08 ]</font>

Kid_Icarus
Nov 21, 2002, 07:20 PM
This should've been called "Complain in this thread or stfu"
If you have a problem with this site, or want something done, at least have the balls to say it.
The only problem I ever had with PSOW is gone.
So I have no complaints cap'n n_n

pixelate
Nov 21, 2002, 07:28 PM
On 2002-11-21 16:20, Kid_Icarus wrote:
This should've been called "Complain in this thread or stfu"



^--*points up*

Saladwood
Nov 21, 2002, 10:37 PM
First of all... WHEEEEEE CAPS ARE FUN! YOU can take it however YOU want it but it's NOT shouting. I don't have to reformat how I PREFER to type because of YOU.



On 2002-11-21 13:09, Danger_Girl wrote:
There is an 'us against them' feel here.


that's the way YOU feel and that's YOUR problem


On 2002-11-21 13:09, Danger_Girl wrote:
This is exacerbated by the mods/admins ganging up in threads.

yeah like you and spy never ganged up on ANYONE ever

ABDUR101
Nov 21, 2002, 10:43 PM
On 2002-11-21 09:06, Spy wrote:
I'd vent but I don't really want to see this topic locked and my response would be deleted anyways http://www.pso-world.com/psoworld/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

Deleted if they break the rules or are offensive, yes. Stop trying to act like you're such a victim. Maybe your posts get deleted because they break the rules, wow, what a thought eh?



One man with a shovel can't hold back the tide.

A man with a shovel should'nt be trying to hold back the tide in the first place. Get a sponge.



On 2002-11-21 13:09, Danger_Girl wrote:
Vibe here is ugly sometimes, not always.

Thats why the mods are rather active in keeping the community friendly and open.



Mods/admin can take things kinda personally sometimes.

That's so overly used it's pathetic. Alot of things are directed at the mods, and we're human, we can take it personal. You're not exactly one to talk.



There is an 'us against them' feel here. This is exacerbated by the mods/admins ganging up in threads.

As pixel said, if someone says or does something, we have to take part and give our viewpoint. And even if we all post in the same thread in agreement with one another, there's nothing wrong with that. We're allowed to give our opinions and viewpoints just as much as any other member. The "Us against them" is all in your head, you put the barrier up between the users and the mods/admins. There's no barrier except the one in your head. The main proof of this is the activity between mods and the users. We get in on the community. Would you rather us all be high and mighty, to the extent that we won't comment on anything? That seems rather absurd and rude.



The posting of the easter lobbys and such don't bother me that much. I can choose not to look at them. Just so you are all aware that it is just a matter of time before the counsle crackers ruin the game as it was meant to be played. By dealing with one, you are condoning it. I'm sorry but that is the simple truth.

Oh, so by your viewpoint, police officers working with drug dealers to capture drug users is also condoning the use of drugs and their sale?

Just because Barubary gave us some pics of hidden things in PSO doesn't mean we condone harmful cheating. It's not black and white as you try to make it seem.

It's not like we posted pics of someone getting PK'd in the lobby or having their weapon stolen out of their bank. We gave the viewers a glimpse of hidden things. Some people were interested, others weren't. Just like every article of news that gets posted, you're either interested or you're not.



I think it would only be fair to mention some of the things I like about PSOW. I like the contests. I think they are a good idea. I might rip them from time to time, but only because I enjoy getting under the skin of you guys and gals so much.

Oh, like how you and spy tried to trick players who were taking part in the contest, telling them that Spy had won and the contest was over? I'm sure those who might have won, had it not been for you two, are very pleased to know that you enjoy tampering with the contests that you so enjoy.



On 2002-11-21 14:24, neko-chan wrote:
Yeah, and it's pathetic.

Who did you call to for help when gally and all of his friends were ganging up and flaming you, neko? You went to the mods, and even I would step in and help if they started on you in a thread. What happened to that? First you complain about all the flaming that happened, and now that we are active in the community, you say we "gang up" on people?



Ironically, liked more the watashiwa way: "I'm the boss here, I'm right while you aren't, so shut up".

At least he had a style. I think it's ridiculous mods always try to defend their own position gangin up like they did here (http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=32789&forum=11&start=10&17).

OK, we can hold a vote on this. We can go back to being elitist and IP banning people who just piss us off. After all, we're all in control, so by that mindset, you should be banned.

Please, you liked Wata being admin just because he had a "style"? You take "style" over commitment?



But so far, examples are endless. The saddest one? The Goth Gurl "affair".

That is so old, wow. And the funniest part is, 99.9% of anyone who ever complained about it weren't even there to see everything that happened. No one ever saw the users and goth-gurl flaming the mods late that night, did you? What's the rule? No flaming. No attacking the mods. What happens if you do so and don't stop? You get banned.

Oh, and might I add. Goth-gurl was never banned. She said a "pleasant" goodbye and left for Shotie's forum. And speaking of which, if Shotie hadn't instigated anything, that whole ordeal would'nt have happened. Shotie was the one who kept getting people riled up and fighting with the mods. Everything was civil until that.



Another thing I don't like is the site itself They're keeping adding contents, and thi is good, but these contents are stored inside the old PSOW "shell", and this is bad. It's a mess. It's an old layout that doesn't fit the new needs of the site.

The needs of the site? The needs of the site were a modding staff who were active to keep up with the influx of new posters that came with the new release of PSO. Followed by new content to coincide with the new version, alongside new site features which the userbase will enjoy and find useful.

The site is fine, it does it's job well. Everything is accessible. And everyone complains about how slow the site is, well guess what? It's slow because we have upwards of 200 people visiting at one time. Yeah, when we only had about 30 people active at once, it did go fast, but you can't expect the same results with so many people accessing the site so often.

You'd think everyone would think about that, and be glad that the site is thriving.



And think also we have at least 3 mods involved in desing and Web stuff. Look eRUPT: every day he has time to fix things, add new features, etc... Probably he doesn't have so much time but he does a great job anyway.

Salad, Lolita, Erupt and RBF add content to the site. Yes, they all do a damn good job.



I think "the other" mods should make an effort on re-designing and creating a new "envelope" for the great new contents. If not I think all the new stuff will just disappear behind the mess.

.."the other" mods? Like pixel said, we do what we can. I don't know HTML and all the other coding needed for a site. Thats why we have Erupt doing alot of the coding, with Lolita, Salad and RBF doing what they do. Adding the content that erupt codes in.

The guides, the info, the pics, pretty much everytime you see an update to the site that wasn't there before, it was one of the above's doing.

The other mods, such as myself, Pixel, rune and hikosaka are actively modding the forums. Yeah, we miss some things, it happens, but alot of the stuff we get on right away.

We all can't update the site, code new things and so on. Would'nt that be pointless? We'd all be doing the same thing, and no one would be modding. Or we'd do one job, and other areas would start to deteriorate. We are spread out and doing different things so we can work at full capacity.

Are there anymore complaints we can take care of? the discussion isn't over as long as there are complaints to be addressed.

DB
Nov 21, 2002, 11:02 PM
Well, that's just how it is... Rules are rules... Life is life. We go by it, day by day. I don't generally have problems with anyone, unless they attack me, and say my opinion is not of my own. Or, if they spread rumors about me, that are unjust. Either way, that is life... We all deal with crap, we all deal with better things as well. It doesn't mean however, that we enjoy either...

This place was made to be a community for honest PSOers, in all its esssence. But, some dis-honesty does go through. And some hate filled comments pass by. Doesn't mean it's the end of the world however.

You say, one man standing against the tide, with a shovel? Ha! If there is something to stand against, don't just postition yourself, and stand agast at what you face... Rise up above it, look beyond it, pass it by, and overcome it.

"Stand tall, and shake the heavens..." -DB-

RuneLateralus
Nov 22, 2002, 02:30 AM
On 2002-11-21 13:09, Danger_Girl wrote:
Mods/admin can take things kinda personally sometimes.


Anyone else tired of that overused argument? Besides, you do not realize how much the crap that they take now and that they took in the past, and they are getting sick and tired of that crap they get for the work they put in.



There is an 'us against them' feel here. This is exacerbated by the mods/admins ganging up in threads.


Only when we see rules are broken.



On 2002-11-21 14:24, neko-chan wrote:
But so far, examples are endless. The saddest one? The Goth Gurl "affair".


I missed the flaming thread, so I really didn't know what was going on and, like you I made an observance at that time that mirrors your view.

But the only reason the view occured was because of Shotie, the one who instigated the whole mess and tried to turn everyone against the mods. I got a lot of wrong and very biased information from her that I took as the truth. It was not until another incident on another forum that showed me what type of person Shotie is: biased, untrustworthy, and self-centered. After that, I thought about the things again, looked back at the incidents and made new views. Do not misunderstand me, I do not hate Shotie, but I feel that I can not really trust her. She is a very big instagater who feels that she is always right and that you are wrong when things are not exactly the same. You can believe what you want, but heed my advice about taking anything from her to be the "gospel truth." Especially when there is more to the story than you know.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RuneLateralus on 2002-11-21 23:33 ]</font>

Neo-Zenji
Nov 22, 2002, 03:02 AM
Why complain I think this site is great.

Sedric
Nov 22, 2002, 03:14 AM
On 2002-11-22 00:02, Neo-Zenji wrote:
Why complain I think this site is great.



My sentiment exactly. But it seems some disagree.

Want some popcorns? I bet this will turn into a very fun show if it turns into WorldBoard War II(or III or IV or whatever): Mods versus Whiners.

Saladwood
Nov 22, 2002, 06:25 AM
bash the mods, bash lolita, she is only currently the biggest content contributor on the site, the one behind all the new guides, and the biggest graphical contributor. you guys sit here and complain while she works for hours on content. at least she's doing something to improve the site.

the people bashing should realize they are not all innocent either. it's always easier to point the finger at someone. when certain users get together it's not ganging up, when the mods do it is. but we can't express our feelings. we're just here to do the job

if you don't like it, leave.

Alielle
Nov 23, 2002, 03:20 PM
On 2002-11-21 19:43, ABDUR101 wrote:


The posting of the easter lobbys and such don't bother me that much. I can choose not to look at them. Just so you are all aware that it is just a matter of time before the counsle crackers ruin the game as it was meant to be played. By dealing with one, you are condoning it. I'm sorry but that is the simple truth.

Oh, so by your viewpoint, police officers working with drug dealers to capture drug users is also condoning the use of drugs and their sale?

That's not a good analogy. Cops work with drug dealers to capture criminals; PSOW is working with Barubary just to get exclusive content, not to punish or crack down on any cheaters.


Just because Barubary gave us some pics of hidden things in PSO doesn't mean we condone harmful cheating. It's not black and white as you try to make it seem.

Where exactly is PSOW going to draw the line when it comes to "harmful" and "non-harmful" cheating? Is PSOW going to accept pictures of modded/duped weapons, too (oh yeah, they did for the DC versions, right?)?

Another thing I'm wondering about: Wasn't Barubary banned quite a few times before? And isn't it kind of funny that, for example, Greg was banned quickly when he created a new account here, while Barubary's 6th account is still active?

I think it's hypocritical to condone some "non-harmful" forms of cheating when PSOW isn't supposed to condone cheating. I won't go into a tirade, but I don't want to see any complaints from the staff when Baru releases cheat codes to the public. The issue becomes pretty black and white when you know who you're dealing with.

Saladwood
Nov 23, 2002, 03:52 PM
On 2002-11-23 12:20, Alielle wrote:Where exactly is PSOW going to draw the line when it comes to "harmful" and "non-harmful" cheating? Is PSOW going to accept pictures of modded/duped weapons, too (oh yeah, they did for the DC versions, right?)?


I'm sorry, we weren't here when that happened. But how do you expect us to verify if screencap of an item is dupped or not? There's no point, it's futile. And besides, our ONLY rule against cheating is DON'T POST CHEAT CODES. We always let discussions about cheating.

On 2002-11-23 12:20, Alielle wrote:

Another thing I'm wondering about: Wasn't Barubary banned quite a few times before? And isn't it kind of funny that, for example, Greg was banned quickly when he created a new account here, while Barubary's 6th account is still active?


When wata and erupt came back, EVERYONE'S ban got lifted. Greg got rebanned when he started flaming people CONSTANTLY. he was WARNED not to flame people on his new account several times, but he didnt' stop. I don't see you mentioning snapple, snapple was banned before, death killer was banned before, but ALL the bans got reset, and people were allowed to come back and have a second chance. Greg messed up. Barubary hasn't done ANYTHING that's bannable.



On 2002-11-23 12:20, Alielle wrote:


I think it's hypocritical to condone some "non-harmful" forms of cheating when PSOW isn't supposed to condone cheating. I won't go into a tirade, but I don't want to see any complaints from the staff when Baru releases cheat codes to the public. The issue becomes pretty black and white when you know who you're dealing with.


READ THE RULES. We don't allow cheat codes, and if Baru actually goes and posts them, of course he'll be banned. But he KNOWS that.

How many people benefitted from his JP to USA ver2 cheat codes? How many people thanked him? It was all over the boards. This was done under the previous administration anyhow.

I'm not saying I agree with cheat codes, because I don't, no matter what they do. You just have to look at everything.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: PSOSaladWood on 2002-11-23 12:54 ]</font>

Ness
Nov 23, 2002, 10:33 PM
Give what I have read here's my opinion about the site: PSo World is not perfect and as long as their are people out there to bitch about it, it never will be. I like PSO World, but I think the site needs a total makeover. Also I think we should have a section just for flaming, that way people can, flame, whine, and bitch all they want. Then people can settle thier differences however they want withou getting banned if they do it in the right place.

As for all the cheating, I say that is Barbury wants to reveal secrets too us then she should be allowed to. No one putrs a gun to your head and forces you tho look at the screenshots. Hell, no one forces you to come here for that matter so if you don't like it here just leave.

And on some more personal notes:



On Posted: 2002-11-21 13:09 Danger_Girl wrote:

Mods/admin can take things kinda personally sometimes.


So can you. I know all about how you react when Spy insults you or says something negative that relates to your type. T

Another thing I've jnoticed is that the mods are still biased.

I've had a few threads that have been locked and I must say that they deserved it. What bakes my noodle is that threads that deserved to be locked even more aren't.

Example: Flame wars between me and Mexican are locked up. While flames between Spy and Danger_Girl are not. While it has gotten better the locking system is still too subjective.



Abudur wrote to neko-chan:
Who did you call to for help when gally and all of his friends were ganging up and flaming you, neko? You went to the mods, and even I would step in and help if they started on you in a thread. What happened to that? First you complain about all the flaming that happened, and now that we are active in the community, you say we "gang up" on people?


Abdur has always been watching out for us and I thank him for that. Now Neko, I don;t know what Gally and friends did to you, but if I knew than waht I knew now I probably would have flamed you with them.

It's not that I hate you you just annoy me becuase you're a fence sitter and an automaton when it comes to member relations.

You say you don't hate me, but whenever Haterade, Dangerous55, or Mexican_Tediz would flame me, you would be so everly eager to jump in. I even PMed you like I did Dangerous to clear things up (it worked with him by the way) and you said you didn't hate me, but then you turn around and flame me with your buddy Haterade.

Liek in the ever famous "Smack a PSOWer" thread, you smacked me "just because everyone else did". You need to form your own damn opinions you fucking automaton.

And quit complaining about the mods Neko. The currents ones are good at what they do and the ones that gave us hell are gone.

ABDUR101
Nov 24, 2002, 01:00 AM
As far as Spy and DG threads being locked, even when we do, we get accused of locking/deleting/moving threads(I.E We're either being accused of being biased towards or against them).

We do whats required on a case-by-case basis. Some threads, due to content, require a deletion(if it's nothing but racist/derogatory remarks, or one worded replies, etc). If something needs moved to the correct forum, we will move it. If something requires a lock, we will lock it, as per the forum rules.

However, when you have afew people hi-jacking multiple threads with tangeants that are meaningless, even though everyone else in the thread is staying on topic, it's not right for us to constantly lock all of the threads due to afew people goofing off. However, if it does get so far out of control, after repeated warnings to those involved, then yes, the thread must be locked, and in some cases, moved(in regard to how far off-topic the thread was taken).

We can't please everyone, but I assure you we're not being biased. Quite the contrary. Just because you don't see us taking direct action doesn't mean we're ignoring it. People are warned, notified of what they've done, and if they keep pulling the same stunts, action will be taken.

Sedric
Nov 24, 2002, 02:59 AM
You know what's so funny? I've noticed this in almost every forums on internet: people who whine and bitch about mods definitely whine and bitch about regular posters when they become mods. They complain that mods are harsh and aren't doing their jobs; but when they become mods, they complain that regular posters don't follow rules and expect too much out of mods. It figures....

And this is especially funny here at PSOW, considering that mods are doing quite well and there isn't much to complain about.

And if someone's still "hazy" about what I'm trying to say, then let me put it in simpler form: if one's gonna complain about mods, he/she should've been in mods' shoes before opening his/her mouth. (And if that person has, then he/she should understand better about the situation and realize there isn't much to complain at all!)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sedric on 2002-11-24 00:03 ]</font>

RuneLateralus
Nov 24, 2002, 03:04 AM
Threads are mainly locked/deleted based on content...like what Abdur said. We try to make the best decisions as we can...even though sometimes they end up being worse than we thought. Still though, we attempt it.

As for the Barubary, I assure if does break the rules, he/she will get punished. Just because he/she is one of the biggest figures in cheating doesn't mean he'she doesn't have the privilage to post here. And if we do ban him/her, then we would do it more for personal reasons than actual legit reasons, making us hypocrites to the rules. True, Barubary was banned before, but he/she was given another chance and Barubary has not ruined it.

As for biasism...that is the last thing I am. I do not single out posters for what they did in the past, but for what they are doing now. For example: I will stop flaming of X (a member I really do not know that well) and warn Y (a member who I am friends with) to stop it and that he will be punished if it continues. I cannot let personal feelings get in the way of judgement for doing my job, whether I like the person or not.

Sedric
Nov 24, 2002, 03:39 AM
About the threads:

It's also funny how many people don't follow rules and guidelines, whether they read it or not, and then complain how mods "take action" about it.

People should realize that when they post something, they have responsibility for what they say and should be ready to accept any actions that mods may take about it. Anyone with common sense would know whether the post, which he/she is about to submit, breaks any rules and/or will be subject under mods' inspection and arrest. If it is not, then ok; but if it is, then the person should not post such materials, or be ready to take responsibility and face the "charges."

In other words, watch what you say, unless you wanna get into trouble. If you do, know that you brought it upon yourself.

Above case would be false, if mods here at PSOW were chosen because they were admin's best friends and/or "ass-kissers." But they are not. I believe they were chosen because they have proven themselves as potential "managers," capable "directors," and above all, they will not misuse the power bestowed on them. So far, I don't see anything wrong with mods themselves.

To sum it all up: if a thread/post was edited/locked/deleted/moved by mods, then there is a GOOD reason for it. And if a poster was warned/banned because it, then that person deserves to be.

Ness
Nov 24, 2002, 07:02 PM
On 2002-11-24 00:39, Sedric wrote:
About the threads:

It's also funny how many people don't follow rules and guidelines, whether they read it or not, and then complain how mods "take action" about it.

People should realize that when they post something, they have responsibility for what they say and should be ready to accept any actions that mods may take about it. Anyone with common sense would know whether the post, which he/she is about to submit, breaks any rules and/or will be subject under mods' inspection and arrest. If it is not, then ok; but if it is, then the person should not post such materials, or be ready to take responsibility and face the "charges."

In other words, watch what you say, unless you wanna get into trouble. If you do, know that you brought it upon yourself.

Above case would be false, if mods here at PSOW were chosen because they were admin's best friends and/or "ass-kissers." But they are not. I believe they were chosen because they have proven themselves as potential "managers," capable "directors," and above all, they will not misuse the power bestowed on them. So far, I don't see anything wrong with mods themselves.

To sum it all up: if a thread/post was edited/locked/deleted/moved by mods, then there is a GOOD reason for it. And if a poster was warned/banned because it, then that person deserves to be.



I've noticed that too. Alot of people break the rules because they don't read them and then get all mad when the mods get on to them.

Spy
Nov 24, 2002, 10:02 PM
On 2002-11-23 12:52, PSOSaladWood wrote:

READ THE RULES. We don't allow cheat codes, and if Baru actually goes and posts them, of course he'll be banned. But he KNOWS that.


Doubtful.



How many people benefitted from his JP to USA ver2 cheat codes? How many people thanked him? It was all over the boards. This was done under the previous administration anyhow.


The thanks were all shortly followed by posts of "How could you betray us barubary? We trusted you *cry cry cry*." I laughed the whole time.



I'm not saying I agree with cheat codes, because I don't, no matter what they do. You just have to look at everything.


You agree with them as long as it gets you exclusive content, so whats with the contradiction?

Balthor
Nov 24, 2002, 11:35 PM
I'll say it again.

You guy's need some fucking gingerbread men.



Ness wrote

automaton



Stop jacking my words, I used that one on you before.

Ness
Nov 25, 2002, 07:58 AM
On 2002-11-24 20:35, Balthor_The_Defiled wrote:
I'll say it again.

You guy's need some fucking gingerbread men.



Ness wrote

automaton



Stop jacking my words, I used that one on you before.



Your right I did jack you word. So what are you going to do about it?

Balthor
Nov 25, 2002, 11:44 AM
Oooooh hollow threats, how tantalizing.

Hmmm what am I gonna do about it. . . I sense a profile jacking coming soon! *swish*

ABDUR101
Nov 25, 2002, 11:59 AM
Balthor, Ness, settle it in pm's ok? It's a single word, which is not owned by anyone. o_O

BlackRose
Nov 25, 2002, 02:33 PM
Let's not forget the note to PSOW Rules #2: If you don't like this site or the way it is run, you are free to find another PSO-related site.

If you don't like it, try to change it. If you can't change it, leave. It's that simple.

Spy
Nov 25, 2002, 02:46 PM
What's up with all the sticky topics? This place is worse that a 14 yr.old's porn-mag.

ABDUR101
Nov 25, 2002, 05:10 PM
On 2002-11-25 11:46, Spy wrote:
What's up with all the sticky topics? This place is worse that a 14 yr.old's porn-mag.


Lets all nit-pick! =D

See, there are these things, known as important topics...they tend to be stickied at the top of a forum so everyone will notice them.

Balthor
Nov 25, 2002, 05:34 PM
Actully, we are ABDUR101, but this threads fun, so anything outta me is crap.

So much drama, I'm suprised you guys didn't get an Oscar yet.

P.S. Ness sucks.

Before you say anything:


. . . so anything outta me is crap.

Zio
Nov 25, 2002, 10:31 PM
userbase

Saladwood
Nov 25, 2002, 11:03 PM
when you run out of real things to say, you pull things out of the air and nitpick.

and oh look how everyone thanks barubary for tallying the servers

Spy
Nov 25, 2002, 11:32 PM
Tallying servers? What are you babeling about, and what's so great about that?

I say again, cavemen and fire.

Saladwood
Nov 26, 2002, 02:06 AM
If you don't know what I'm talking about, then that's your problem. I'm not babbling <correct spelling of the word btw), if you don't know what I'm talking about go READ the forums instead of complaining about it.

Yet again, if all you can do is complain about this site, why stick around and complain about it? Why is it so hard for you to just leave? Do you really have that little to do? Complaining about stickies?

Spy
Nov 26, 2002, 02:47 AM
On 2002-11-25 23:06, PSOSaladWood wrote:
If you don't know what I'm talking about, then that's your problem. I'm not babbling <correct spelling of the word btw), if you don't know what I'm talking about go READ the forums instead of complaining about it.


Tower of Babel. It was a joke. But it was wasted I guess. Ah well.

And I read all the stuff. I'm assuming you're talking about the fact though that Barubary was the first one on the servers, and got their names? What's so cool and thank-worthy about that?



Yet again, if all you can do is complain about this site, why stick around and complain about it?


This is the complaint thread. I'm staying on topic. I'm following the rules.



Why is it so hard for you to just leave?


Ragol.com got shut down. So you guys are it, until you get shut down. So uh, live with it.



Do you really have that little to do? Complaining about stickies?


Hehehe X'D

Saladwood
Nov 26, 2002, 04:00 AM
Uhm, ragol isn't dead.

Spy
Nov 26, 2002, 04:11 AM
On 2002-11-26 01:00, PSOSaladWood wrote:
Uhm, ragol isn't dead.



http://www.ragol.com

If they changed URLs I would love the new link. Please sir, I'd like some more!

Saladwood
Nov 26, 2002, 08:17 AM
it's been posted numerous times

Ness
Nov 26, 2002, 09:18 AM
Ragol.com is dead. OThe only thing that survives is it's forum.

Spy
Nov 26, 2002, 12:01 PM
On 2002-11-26 05:17, PSOSaladWood wrote:
it's been posted numerous times



So... you're in denial or just plain wrong in saying that Ragol.com isn't dead?

Ness
Nov 26, 2002, 01:47 PM
Ragol.com is not legally dead since it's forum is still alive. But it is informatively dead in that it no longer is a PSO info site.

Saladwood
Nov 26, 2002, 05:07 PM
spy which part of ragol.com isn't dead do you not understand, or do you just have to be an ass and criticize everything. oh i think it's the later

pixelate
Nov 26, 2002, 05:15 PM
http://hey.to/pso

ABDUR101
Nov 26, 2002, 05:54 PM
On 2002-11-25 23:47, Spy wrote:
This is the complaint thread. I'm staying on topic. I'm following the rules.


Complaining is one thing, pulling things out of thin air to nit-pick over is another entirely.

If you're going to complain, atleast give valid arguements. Items to complain about such as sticky topics doesn't say much.

Complain and Contribute! =D

Ness
Nov 26, 2002, 10:36 PM
On 2002-11-26 14:07, PSOSaladWood wrote:
spy which part of ragol.com isn't dead do you not understand, or do you just have to be an ass and criticize everything. oh i think it's the later



Sorry Salad, but I couldn't help but notice the hypocricy of your statement. Here you are caliing Spy an ass when you took Spys harmless states and gave and violent and deriding response. And don't say that you only did it this once because that's not true. You did it to me too.
http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic=31624&forum=11&start=25

Now read my response at the bottom of the page. Anyway, back to what I was saying, you just attacked me for no reason. The only difference between me and Spy is that spy's words pertained to you, but mine were not idrected to you in anyway and you just decided to attack me.

And you can't say that I did what I told you not to do because I was in this conversation too.

Spy
Nov 27, 2002, 12:40 AM
On 2002-11-26 14:07, PSOSaladWood wrote:
spy which part of ragol.com isn't dead do you not understand, or do you just have to be an ass and criticize everything. oh i think it's the later



The website part of it is dead. The messageboard wasn't the highlight in my honest opinion, but rather the item dbase, walkthroughs, movies, etc. etc. were what made Ragol.com the #1 pso site. Ragol.com is no more, the messageboard is a lobotomized version.

And for the record, I don't criticize everything, just shody stuff and idiocy.

And sticky topics? You guys are complaining about me complaining about that?

Here's one that isn't materializing out of thin air: Lack of any sense of humor by the vocal administration(short of maliciousness that is - "A topic by Spy! Kill it! Ehehehehehehehehehe!").

Danger_Girl
Nov 27, 2002, 01:09 AM
Just a few quick things...

First of all, Abdur I don't know you, but I would be willing to bet you're an alright guy. You do a fine as moderator, which is of course a thankless job. Compairing you guys posting Barbs hacks to the police using narcs to bag dope dealers is absurd, but I think you know that...at least I hope you do.

PSOSaladWood, you can post however the hell you want, of course. It is general etiquette that caps is precieved as shouting. I am not sure how you see them...perhaps you can explain why you use caps the way you do.

Now I said that mods/admins can sometimes take things personally here. Alot of you replied by saying that was an old complaint. Perhaps so, but let me explain. I had an occasion where a mod here and I ran into each other on one of the blocks. The person refused to acknowledge me. So be it, of course. It was that persons choice. But I want it to be clear that I certainly don't want any bad feelings to be derived due to these silly fights we have on the message boards. I don't take anything to heart, and hope you don't either.

As far as complaining about the 'look' of the website, I have no complaints there, cause I know you all do a hell of a lot better job than I could.

I know you all work hard. We give you a hard time often. But what can I say...I like to be the thorn in the side of all authority figures =p

Saladwood
Nov 27, 2002, 01:45 AM
ness you made a thread generalizing all newbie posters. Maybe to you that is some noble crusade, but for me that's just stupid. spy saying that i am in denial or just plain wrong, for no reason, when i told him the link has been posted numerous times, what is that for?



On 2002-11-26 22:09, Danger_Girl wrote:
I know you all work hard. We give you a hard time often. But what can I say...I like to be the thorn in the side of all authority figures =p


A thorn in the side of all authority figures for what? Nothing? When it's done in the right way fine. But when it's done 'just because,' there's no point.

ABDUR101
Nov 27, 2002, 02:10 AM
On 2002-11-26 22:09, Danger_Girl wrote:
First of all, Abdur I don't know you, but I would be willing to bet you're an alright guy. You do a fine as moderator, which is of course a thankless job.

Anyone who takes the time to know me even a little will know that. I'm not a hard person to talk to or be around.



Compairing you guys posting Barbs hacks to the police using narcs to bag dope dealers is absurd, but I think you know that...at least I hope you do.

No, I'd say it was a fitting analogy in comparison to you attributing PSOW warranting the use of malicious code in regards to afew pics of hidden things in PSO being posted.

You made it sound as if PSOW had suddenly warranted the use of any and all cheat codes, no matter how malicious they are to the general gaming public of PSO. You made an absurd gesture, you got an absurd analogy in comparison.



I know you all work hard. We give you a hard time often. But what can I say...I like to be the thorn in the side of all authority figures =p

As Salad said, it's entirely pointless. All your doing is showing off just for the attention. If you appreciated our work, you'd do more to help us along rather than be a pain.

I guess it's just easier to sit on the side lines, pointing fingers and giggling than to offer any real input. And thats fine, by all means, sit and giggle, but also realise that you have no place to talk about anything on this site since you aren't willing to offer any true feedback.


And no spy, we're not complaining about you nit picking about the sticky topics, but we do find it rather sad that you had to post that as a complaint when this thread is supposed to generate feed back about why people don't like this site.

Spy
Nov 27, 2002, 03:09 AM
On 2002-11-26 23:10, ABDUR101 wrote:

And no spy, we're not complaining about you nit picking about the sticky topics, but we do find it rather sad that you had to post that as a complaint when this thread is supposed to generate feed back about why people don't like this site.




...



"Complain in this thread or STFU"...

Nowhere in the topic title does it state the size of any complaints to be made or if they have to be found happy or sad. Seeing 7 or 8 sticky topics on a board where you're only viewing 15-25 topics a page is insane.

Saladwood, baby, common. You said:


spy which part of ragol.com isn't dead do you not understand[...]

How is it not dead? They have a messageboard. Whoohoo. All their other content is gone. Like I said. Lobotomized. Good as dead.

ABDUR101
Nov 27, 2002, 03:35 AM
On 2002-11-27 00:09, Spy wrote:
Nowhere in the topic title does it state the size of any complaints to be made or if they have to be found happy or sad. Seeing 7 or 8 sticky topics on a board where you're only viewing 15-25 topics a page is insane.


As taken from Pixel's first post of this thread:

"Instead of complaining at some other safe haven, let us know by venting in this thread; that way, we'll have a better idea about what we should be focused on."

Incase you missed it, he was referring to people posting gripes with the site that are causing them to bash it at other sites that they stay at.

Do you honestly complain at your forum about the sticky topics here? I don't see them as that big of a problem, and never have. They are stickied for a reason. They are up top so everyone can read them due to importance.

Instead of saying about the sticky topics, you could have offered "You know, you could add something to the site so we can set the amount of threads that are viewed per page". I take it thats the problem, yeah?




Saladwood, baby, common.

How is it not dead? They have a messageboard. Whoohoo. All their other content is gone. Like I said. Lobotomized. Good as dead.


I thought she was referring to the forum. o_O

eRUPT
Nov 27, 2002, 03:43 AM
Why has this thread just become a chat log between some whom have nothing intelligent to offer in regards to why this topic was actually made?

Very sad to see.

Ness
Nov 27, 2002, 09:50 AM
On 2002-11-26 22:45, PSOSaladWood wrote:
ness you made a thread generalizing all newbie posters. Maybe to you that is some noble crusade, but for me that's just stupid. spy saying that i am in denial or just plain wrong, for no reason, when i told him the link has been posted numerous times, what is that for?



You missed my point entirely and still managed to get an insult in as well. I thought my point would have been easy for a 25 year -old to understand which means either two things.
1. You can't admit that you have a personality defect of responding to people with harsh and unwarranted remarks.
2. You're just really fucking stupid and/or immature.

I think it's number one, but if you want to correct me on that go right ahead.

Since you didn't get my point the first time I'll say it again.

The point I was trying to make is that you go out of your way to flame somone about something they wrote when it doesn't apply to you and you could care less about it.
Example: My thread n00b posters.
It didn't even apply to you and I didn't even mention your name, but you found some reason to jumop in there and insult me when I had never done anything to you in the past.

And with the Spy ordead in this topic:

He does have a point and you know. Ragol.com is dead. Everything that made the site good is gone and only the message board remains. So Ragol.com the website is dead, but Ragol.com the messageboard is not. That's the point he was trying to make andf you kept peretending he was worng so you could continue to whine about and insult him.


Now back to what Abdur was saying.

To solve the Sticky problem, just make a topic for all the important threads that way we don't have all these stickies, but all the information is still there. You see, everybody wins. :happy:

eRUPT
Nov 27, 2002, 11:55 AM
Ness:
Ok so you can make a thread called All n00bs suck (which btw expresses a great sense of maturity alone) But salad cannot say that no you can't say all n00bs suck? I've actually witnessed you myself flame, you are certainly not innocent. I'm failing to see the reasoning behind this. And your missing out entirely on what spy is doing with this thread being a very annoying child, and your joining him. Salad is right, stop being an elitist by making a n00bs suck topic.

Anyhow this thread is being locked now.

If you hate this place then just LEAVE.

Both children:
If you have some gripe boys, you PM me and we'll straighten it out. I have no time for kids, and I could really care less about whiners that do NOTHING but come to my board to post SPAM of their rants which place them in some kind of helpless idiot category of lonely teens trying to be rebelious with no reason and its QUITE pathetic. Want attention? go make a penpal or something, your a gnat to me.

*lock*