Sonic the Hedgehog

[Midicronica]

As a long time Sonic fan I can honestly say I'm disappointed with the next installment in the Sonic series. Each game since Sonic Adventure 2 has been failure and I feel that this one will go right along with it.

There are just too many problems in this game to excuse and I'll list some, but I won't go into detail. There are definate problems with the loading times where it will take 15-30 seconds to load one line of speech, the camera, the addition of secondary characters during the mission (this completely slows down the gameplay), the auto-running are straight-forward and you have no control over the character while in the process, and other small tidbits that I just don't feel like posting.

*sigh* I was truly hoping that this game would breath life back into the Sonic series after a small chain of bad eggs, but it seems that I was mistaken. I'm not giving up on Sonic completely but I'm definately disappointed.

[Kent]

...Is it better than Heroes, at least?

[KodiaX987]

Kent, even Bible Adventures is better than Heroes.

[Midicronica]

Yeah, it's better than Heroes, but it's stilly pretty bad. I'm not really saying the game is unplayable or dosen't have a fun factor because, then I would just be lying. It's just there are so many small things that Sonic Team could have fixed if they would have taken an example from Shadow the Hedgehog and Sonic Heroes.

[Neoswayne]

Oh geez Heroes was horrible. It was the only game I got bored of in one day. I think I was more interested in PSO3 than it. I just hope PSU is SEGA turning over a new leaf, b/c they don't have many good games recently. If only Sonic would go to the Wii, sigh* oh well I guess sonic betrayed Japan (GCN) for an American company (XB360)

[Link5]

Hah, I actually didn't mind Heroes. Admittedly it had flaws, but I don't think it was as bad as everyone made it out to be. Since then I think the series has been in a downward spiral though. The new Sonic really does have several things that add up to make it somewhat dissapointing. I've not played the other two characters, but from what I hear they are even worse. It's too bad because this sonic really did look good.

[PJ]

Wow, Neoswayne, that post was so filled with stupid that my IQ dropped a couple notches

[Ether]

Sonic games have been getting worse ever since the 2nd one. On Genesis

Hopefully Sonic Wildfire (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ruxm9D0p6P8) is good

[Dek]

On 2006-11-22 18:53, KodiaX987 wrote:
Kent, even Bible Adventures is better than Heroes.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v607/arthas_zero/Misc/RockLee.jpg

Personally, I think I'll stick with the Sonic titles on the Genesis. I haven't been disappointed with those three (or four, if you count Sonic and Knuckles http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif )...

[Celestial]

after SA2 ive been very depressed with sonic as of late.

BUT Sonic Rush is all kinds of awesome!

[Lovejuice]

Seriously, I have never "LOL"ed so much during a Sonic game in my entire life. The story, the "serious business" of Soleana, Mephiles, all of it. I burst in to giggles during the "Last" story something fierce [SUPER SPOILERS INCOMING] Y'know, when SONIC DIES FROM AN EVIL FIREY FORCE USING A VERSION OF SHADOW'S DARKNESS TO EXIST FIRING A BEAM THROUGH HIS CHEST MAKING THE PRINCESS CRY TO RELEASE THE FIRE FROM HER HEART - but then perhaps this is mainly due to what I grew up knowing as 'Sonic' (and in fairness, "evil egg shaped genius man using coloured stones to power big floating Star Wars spacebase rip off, then crashing in to island and tricking pink ant eater in to fisticuffing with a hedgehog whilst making robots everywhere" is probably equally stupid).

But, gameplay wise, it does actually have some moments where I thought "hey, y'know, this actually works really great" (example: Radical Train), but these moments are steeped under so many layers of bullshit - for example 'Amigo' characters (FPS mode with Tails throwing Ring Bombs, err?), carrying the Princess, horrendous loading times, certain Mach Speed sections (example: Radical Train), every single Town Mission - that you can never really appreciate them (and the ratio of bullshit to non-bullshit is completely horrendous). Funnily enough, Silver's game was actually quite refreshing and one of the more fun parts, perhaps this is due to the fact the developers (the lead director on the project is not the same one from SA/SA2/Heroes) had complete freedom with the character and gameplay and were not tied down to making it 'Sonic', who's gameplay seems the weakest of the three main characters.

The depressing thing is that despite all this, you get the feeling that Sonic Team actually really tried this time, even more so if all the hype and "Sonic going back to his roots" talk is to be believed. And despite the stupidness of the story and stuff, the production values during the CGI bits are top notch (well except the voice acting, but that's a whole other kettle of fish due to 4Kids' contractual agreement with Sega right now).

I can't help but think that by "back to his roots" they actually meant more of a total reboot of Sonic as a franchise, when the kids of today look back at Sonic in 15 years time, "Sonic the Hedgehog" is what they will think think series originates from or at least be the 'benchmark' (and the GBA port of Sonic 1 is just horrible unfortunately..).

The music was a nice suprise. It's completely different from any other Sonic project thus far, but I actually found myself enjoying many tracks because of it as they do fit the atmosphere of the game, many of which have a more ambient feel, and is one of the game's more stand-out aspects (P.S. See the non-Tyra part of my signature for the best thing from the entire game).

If you really want to spoil yourselves, you can view the intros and endings to all the stories (including the "Last" one) on Youtube by clicking -> here (http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=XanderChaos). But don't say I didn't warn you.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Lovejuice on 2006-11-22 21:51 ]</font>

[SubstanceD]

Now I'm confused.

On Gamefaqs, most of the reviews for this game are very positive. Granted, almost every single person has complained about the loading times and various camera angle problems but still, positve reviews.

I was planning on buying this game when it was released in Europe tomorrow.

I loved the first Sonic Adventure on the Dreamcast, wasn't too keen on Sonic Adventure 2. Wouldn't touch any of the other 3D Sonic Games with a 20 foot pole. Would I like this game or should I avoid it like the plague?

[Lovejuice]

- More wall of text -

This game is Sonic Adventure 3. It inherits many of the flaws frequent in the 3D Sonics, but also goes to some length to rectify a few. Namely, that despite the wider (and higher) areas, there are less frequent pit deaths (and two of the characters have inherent abilities to counter this), and with a bit of gaming, there are a good number of alternative paths to explore. Based on earlier videos of Shadow's game, one expected wide open areas with which to run, but these are pretty much exclusive to sections of Shadow's game. And just like the Adventures and Heroes, each new game only adds more problems along the way to counterpoint any 'fixes'.

Shadow's game is actually a huge improvement over Shadow the Hedgehog, he essentially plays like a slower Sonic with chaos powers who can combo. It gets a bit ropey when you have to jump in a car and fire missiles and that, but if the Shadow the Hedgehog game was actually like this, I would've enjoyed it considerably more (which is something, because I couldn't stand Shadow at all).

Things like the Town Stages - which are super enlarged versions of Sonic Adventure's Adventure Fields - don't seem to add a great deal other than settings for the (actually well done) cut-scenes and an excuse to make you run 4 minutes to reach a door, or partake in a frustrating Town Mission along the lines of "Run through these rings in X time!", which does very little to help enhance the gameplay experience, especially as your new found skill in each challenge generally has very little use in the actual stages themselves. Despite the fact they are huge and can be pretty to look at, the towns are entirely uninteresting and devoid of life (and life you do find has a habit of slapping you with loading times in order to reveal one sentence from a bland human model). At least in Sonic Adventure these areas, whilst not being particularily populated or lively in themselves, were short, compact, and to the point, and were detailed and interesting enough within their size (Mystic Ruin's 'Jungle' field is infinetely more interesting than huge Soleanna's forest and field) for these issues to not be a great nuisance. The Town Stages could've worked really well to help add to Soleanna (which despite the sillyness of the story, had possibility to be a rather interesting setting, which is a shame, because the Princess isn't completely detestable). The game does manage to portray a slightly darker and more realisitic world, while allowing the Sonic character to exist, as they do little to change Sonic as a character despite the Human x Furry premise, preferring to flesh out the (new) people and surroundings around him and having them react to the Sonic characters we know. Princess Elise is the greatest example of this, and is a more berable version of Chris from Sonic X with breasts, and is voiced by Gretchen Weiners from Mean Girls.

The more I watch the well done cut-scenes and movies, perhaps Sonic Team should've made a movie or something. They keep trying to do something grander and epic with each new Sonic and seem to be hitting a wall - they told us they weren't going to do it with Heroes, but then pulled that whole Last Story Metal Sonic nonsense on us - causing the climax to be no more epic than the one before it. Much like a complaint of SA, SA2, and Heroes, they simply need to strip everything down and focus on a core, simple gameplay experience - with Sonic, because no matter how much we insult the character, he's still forever likable - and then build on top of it, rather than the other way around which is how this comes across. Hopefully Sonic Wii may follow this path as it is following a simple mechanic by conception, thanks to the whole Wiimote deal.

The Amigo system just causes all manner of annoyance. Just as you're managing to get used to Sonic or someone and actually enjoy it for what it is (example: White Acropolis), along pops a friend to forcibly take over the action with a different style of playing, the majority of which are completely mundane, and throw things out of balance (another example; playing as Shadow in Kingdom Valley, and actually having a good time, and then all of a sudden you have to switch to Rouge to hunt akin to SA2 for three keys but with no hints or anything in an absolutely huge area with a busted combat system). The Amigo system works between Silver and Blaze in my experience however, Silver's suprisingly fun gameplay is considerably slower than Sonic's and more strategic, but when you switch to Blaze, you are essentially treated to a Sonic-esque speed section with some platform elements - and the joke is that Blaze actually controls better than Sonic - which works rather well because you will have been used to the faster game of Sonic and Shadow rather than forcing you to then go in to FPS mode and throw bombs of Rings or such nonsense.

The game isn't terrible, but I can't help but feel if they'd kept it in development for a good few more months (rather than rush it out for Christmas and Sonic's 15th anniversary.. remember how SA2 was rushed out for Sonic's 10th?) they could've actually nailed it this time. It seems like most of the time was spent creating Silver's, and even Shadow's, gameplay and the entire setting of Soleanna - while Sonic's gameplay and controls were left as one of the last things to polish - as they either ran out of time, or even worse, assumed they've "got it" and it doesn't need to be looked at further (when it really comes off like an upgraded Shadow the Hedgehog out-of-the-car experience). He plays a lot heavier than in previous games, which sounds like a nice throwback to the classic 2D games, but actually doesn't execute well at all, ironically the tighter controls of SA2 would be much preferred here. He is much clunkier on the ground, and it takes a lot longer to build up speed than in SA/SA2, which isn't a bad idea, but doesn't execute well seeing as you will then be drawn to a halt rather soon, where no level of game skill will allow you to maintain your speed (which is something the original 2D Sonic's enabled you to do).

Again, the game isn't completely awful, and it does have some solid moments amongst it. I just really believe it needed more development time. And they still need to learn to remove all of the crap that cakes over the fun parts of the game. The game pulls together some good bits from all 3D Sonics and adds its own, but also brings along many of the problems associated with the series, and again, adds its own. It's hard to gauge if being a fan of Sonic Adventure is enough to warrant a purchase of this $50 game (I would however recommend renting it, or buying it if the price drops, of course if you are a big Sonic fan like myself, you may be sucked in to buying it anyway), as people liked SA for very different reasons, but if you believe that SA, SA2, and even Shadow and Heroes had glimmers of hope within them, then Sonic the Hedgehog is no different. The exact same glimmer is still there, but it's still coated in a thick layer of er.. something brown and thick. Much like its predecessors.

If anyone wishes to continue spoiling themselves, almost all of the in-game cutscenes and CGI have now been uploaded to Youtube here (http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=Shadowoffire123).

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Lovejuice on 2006-11-23 10:11 ]</font>

[RoninJoku]

heh... All the press reviews I've seen have been horrible... There was a time when I planned on using this game to help justify a purchase of an Xbox360... But now... :/... Yea, my faith in Sonic has been brutally shaken in the past few years... Perhaps Wildfire will be good. I certainly hope it will, but I'm not going to get excited about it.

[Sha_Hua]

I feel the same pain.

I really liked the sonic games, but something went wrong when the went 3d.
On the mega drive you could really pick up speed. Most of the time sonic ended up on the right side of my screen cause I was at full speed. Ofcourse there where always some parts that needed a more tactfull approach, but that kept the game interesting.

In sonic adventure you still had parts where you could pick up speed but you needed to watch out for stuff like cliffs :S. But the game was awesome, great story and stuff, so I didn't care about that.
After that the games actually never gave me that sonic feeling.
Why can't they just make a sonic game like in the 90's, able to sprint through the levels or take your time, multiple routes to get to the end with better items on the harder routes, falling in lava and burning your as instead of falling of a cliff all of the time. Ofcourse there will have to be more to the game than that but it's a nice base to start from.

About the speech problems. This is insane. Why does this have loading time at all!? Sounds like bad programming.
I really like text balloons due to the game going at the speed you want it to go. Why can't they make it selectable in the menu which you want, speech of text.

I really hope sega treats us on a decent sonic game in the near future. The fans deserve it.

[Splash]

I haven't played the game yet, but to be honest, from the looks of the videos and screenshots of the game, I can say that it impresses me a whole lot because it is what I wanted in a Sonic game for a long time already.

In my opinion, I honestly found all the 3D Sonic games to be fun, even Sonic Heroes. It was unique and something different. It just had a slight poor execution at gameplay but nonetheless, I found it fun. Sonic Adventure (DX) was more fun with all of the adventure fields, and that is included into Sonic the Hedgehog (360) which impresses me so. Sonic Adventure 2 was also fun, had a great storyline and suspenseful at a sort. Giving Sonic the Hedgehog (360) an epic like storyline is brilliant, especially from watching the opening story scenes from each character.

I did look at the reviews from some of the game sites. No doubt that they all complained about loading screens which I agree would be the downfall for the game. But the rest are all biased, camera "problems", "terrible" graphics, and the like. Yeah right, camera seems to have improved majorly from the past, the graphics look awesome on their own. So these reviews I don't trust at all, no matter what, I'm still going to get this game eventually.

[Moo2u]

The cut scenes are BEAUTIFUL! I mean, man! They really nailed it there.

I haven't played it, so I can't really comment on the playing style, but already storywise I know their problem. TOO MANY CHARACTERS. Stick with Sonic, Tails and Knuckles; if you dig deep enough, these are three interesting characters to play with. I loved all the Gensis games as well as SA1 and 2, and I think it's possible to make a good new Sonic game. It's like after the DC when Sega was like, "Yup, no more good Sonic for you!"

....still! Those are some pretty pretty graphics, I tell ya what.

[Daikarin]

I have to confess I was seduced by the videos, in which the hedgehog would dash through a stage at an awesome speed, but if the game is even AS glitchy as Heroes, I won't give it a go. And if critics say it's even worse, then...

[RoninJoku]

On 2006-11-23 19:33, Splash wrote:
I haven't played the game yet, but to be honest, from the looks of the videos and screenshots of the game, I can say that it impresses me a whole lot because it is what I wanted in a Sonic game for a long time already.

In my opinion, I honestly found all the 3D Sonic games to be fun, even Sonic Heroes. It was unique and something different. It just had a slight poor execution at gameplay but nonetheless, I found it fun. Sonic Adventure (DX) was more fun with all of the adventure fields, and that is included into Sonic the Hedgehog (360) which impresses me so. Sonic Adventure 2 was also fun, had a great storyline and suspenseful at a sort. Giving Sonic the Hedgehog (360) an epic like storyline is brilliant, especially from watching the opening story scenes from each character.

I did look at the reviews from some of the game sites. No doubt that they all complained about loading screens which I agree would be the downfall for the game. But the rest are all biased, camera "problems", "terrible" graphics, and the like. Yeah right, camera seems to have improved majorly from the past, the graphics look awesome on their own. So these reviews I don't trust at all, no matter what, I'm still going to get this game eventually.




If you haven't played the game, then who are you to say whether the game has camera problems or not? And who the hell said the game had terrible graphics? I haven't seen one review claiming such. I also think it's rather silly to be calling them biased seemingly just because they thought the game was bad. The truth is, everyone wants to like Sonic games... Some of us just find it extremely difficult to do so based on ST's recent efforts.

[Kizaragu]

I played the demo and wasn't impressed.
Regardless of that, I Borrowed the game from work overnight in a bid to give it a second chance.
The intro was awesome and actually got me pretty excited, then the game began and I wept salty tears. It was a reality check to say the least.
The camera makes the game near on unplayable, the loading times are rediculouse, and the blatant flaws are undeniable. How a lot of them got by without notice from testing I'll never know.
I had high hopes for this one and was left cold, bitter and disapointed.

[Midicronica]

The loading times are one of the things that piss me off the most. It's amazing that you need 15 seconds to load a single line of speech or an introduction for a boss. If it weren't for the load times, I think I could actually enjoy the game a lot more.

[Moo2u]

You know what I just thought of that pissed me off? I'm pretty sure Sega put alot of money into this game, what with the drool worthy graphics, and the pretty cool looking displays show at E3. Hopefully this won't put them in the hole moreso then they already are.

Bring Yugi Naka back to Sonic Team!

[Neoswayne]

Just wondering did anyone else like the chao minigame as much as I did. I thought it was fun except I could never get one of the Super Special Chao....*sigh*

[DonRoyale]

On 2006-11-22 19:51, Neoswayne wrote:
If only Sonic would go to the Wii,


Sonic is coming to the Wii...>>

[DonRoyale]

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SereneShadows on 2006-11-25 17:03 ]</font>

[Link5]

The game actually gets better in my opinion. At first I didn't really think I would find any good in it, but after the beginning that puts you off, the levels do get better and the storyline is kind of interesting. I'd say it falls in between Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog, but this could vary for others as it looks like many people didn't like Sonic Heroes at all.

[RoninJoku]

On 2006-11-25 23:57, Link5 wrote:
The game actually gets better in my opinion. At first I didn't really think I would find any good in it, but after the beginning that puts you off, the levels do get better and the storyline is kind of interesting. I'd say it falls in between Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog, but this could vary for others as it looks like many people didn't like Sonic Heroes at all.



Hmm, well I would say that between Heroes and Shadow is not an accomplishment at all... nope. That's pretty bad.

[Link5]

You're absolutely right. It's not an accomplishment. I was just saying looking past all the glitchy buggyness of the game, there are some decent levels and at the very least I'd say it's an improvement from Shadow. It's still far from what we'd all like to see in a Sonic game. Here's hoping Wii's Sonic will end up good.

[Sayara]

On 2006-11-25 01:58, Shadow_Moses wrote:
The loading times are one of the things that piss me off the most. It's amazing that you need 15 seconds to load a single line of speech or an introduction for a boss. If it weren't for the load times, I think I could actually enjoy the game a lot more.



Hi PSU

[Neoswayne]

I wish they would incorporate the chao in the newer sonic games like MAGs or something. That way they would have special skills to help you on the field.....just a suggestion for the sonic tem.

[Sayara]

No. Chao were not that much of an innovation. More of a distraction of the actual game,

[PJ]

Hi PSU



What version of PSU are YOU playing?

[Sayara]

Ps2. It takes a good 15 seconds to load up seeing Mr De Ragen or many other scenes of which

[Neoswayne]

IDK, I kinda liked the chao. I thought they were fun, because the game was too short without them

[PJ]

I didn't like the emblems associated with the Chao, but it was fun raising them. Atleast ST still remembers they made them (Random cameos http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif)

[Neoswayne]

Yes Finally someone else

[Midicronica]

Yeah, I liked Chao raising I spent most of my time in the Chao gardens experimenting and raising a lot of Chao.

Has anyone encountered the Chao's on Moatoob yet? They popped up in a Valley of Carnage run I was doing with a friend. They're not called Chao and I really can't remember the name. Of course, with them being rare and all it dropped a synthesis item.

[Neoswayne]

I think mine filled up. *'o'*