Casual use of Over End is bad...

[The_Pup]

A number of enemy patterns require actual dodging, meaning it will require movement, movement is downtime for Normal Attacks. It is however not downtime for PA's. You can move while charging, you cannot swing your sword while moving.

Again another mistake of your formula. Your formula makes only 1 assumption, that the person using Normal Attacks is always attacking There is no time for dodging, no time for adjusting facings, no time for running towards enemies, no time waiting for enemies to spawn, and that enemies will always spawn in range, enemies will not move around.

That is an unrealistic scenario.

PA's on the other hand do not need that scenario. Charging can be done while moving, charging allows the player to move out of range, negating the need for dodging and moving to the side or behind an enemy, charging can be down while waiting for enemies to spawn, charging can be down while the enemy is not in range, and you only need to hit the enemy once so even if the enemy moves around you only need it to be in the correct range once.

Again, you are wrong. I can attack and not need to dodge when I activate mag-nature invincibility. EVA builds can always attack.

You are also thinking that perfect world scenarios don't correlate with real world scenarios. This one does. You only need to multiply the APS by however many enemies OE hits.

This guide says that OE is practically useless versus single enemies and the player is better off normal/hard attacking them.

Common sense after reading this guide dictates: OE versus groups, if equal to or less than 2 then start attacking normally.

[RRyuugu]

i side step/dodge all the time

When you side step or roll you are not attacking.

Charge time is already part of the DPS formula. Sidestepping and Dodging is not.

[RRyuugu]

MAG Invincibility is not a constant factor of the game. It cannot be controlled except for Flozir 4.

Flozir 4 obviously is something that will not be available all the time as it requires 4 full gauges.

This guide only shows that given a scenario that can not be replicated all the time, Over End will not be as effect as Normal Attacking. As I've mentioned earlier you have failed to give even one reasonably replicable scenario in this game where OE spam is inefficient compared to Normal and Heavy Attack.

All the scenarios you've listed involve outrageous assumptions like MAG invincibility, or fail the requirement that the person using Normal Attack will always be attacking.

Not moving, not moving to the side, not waiting for NPCs to engage first, always be in range of an enemy at all times

[The_Pup]

If you wait for NPCs to draw aggro then that's down time. If you charge in ahead then enemies will consider you a prime target.

Other players? Who's to assure the Sword user that these other players are melee? Or that they're not the hit and run type with PAs? If you're grouped with gun users then you'll retain all the aggro. If you're grouped with an Over End spammer who runs away while he's charging, and even Over End spammers don't need get too close that the mob will shift aggro to them.

Stop giving unrealistic scenarios.

NPCs drawing aggro doesn't add to downtime. It takes away from downtime as the enemies aren't aiming for the player, they also add 1 APS. Also gun users stun most small enemies and draw aggro from others and paralize if they have it on their gun (through element or PA). Forces can paralyze enemies and remove downtime almost entirely.

[RRyuugu]

No it adds to down time. You need to wait for the NPCs to move forward before engaging the enemy yourself.

That is down time you are not attacking while waiting for the enemies to target the NPCs.

How does paralyzing an enemy remove down time? Because it can't move away? That's a faulty assumption. It requires that the enemy is close enough to the player. If the Force paralyzes a Finjer you will still need to move towards it and still attack it. Down time still exists. It only partially removes the downtime of following the enemy around but you will still need to move towards the enemy and during that time you are not attacking.

And how are you assured that Rangers will use Stun? Celeb is the most popular element. As for Forces GiMegid+Magical Sign is a popular enough, a combination which is powerful enough to take a lot of enemies down on it's own without any help from a Sword user.

[The_Pup]

MAG Invincibility is not a constant factor of the game. It cannot be controlled except for Flozir 4.

Flozir 4 obviously is something that will not be available all the time as it requires 4 full gauges.

This guide only shows that given a scenario that can not be replicated all the time, Over End will not be as effect as Normal Attacking. As I've mentioned earlier you have failed to give even one reasonably replicable scenario in this game where OE spam is inefficient compared to Normal and Heavy Attack.

All the scenarios you've listed involve outrageous assumptions like MAG invincibility, or fail the requirement that the person using Normal Attack will always be attacking.

Not moving, not moving to the side, not waiting for NPCs to engage first, always be in range of an enemy at all times

You are wrong again. PB gain can be controlled consistantly. PA use allows for faster PB accumulation than normally attacking. If you use guns, you can accumulate PA a little less quickly without the "risk" you are talking about.

OE spam is inefficient against single phobos, single Arks, single anything. You can get better results spamming normal/hard attacks on 2 or 3 smaller enemies.

[johnwolf]

did you forget that one enemy can side step out of OE's narrow line of attack easly. think about how the player pulls out the OE, he has to make a glowing blade erupt around the sword first. in this time a fast enemy can and would move out of the way (78% of the time). player misses putting APS at 0. player swings sword. sence the sword has a high flintch rate, leaves enemy open for next attack. after this combo enemy is still recovering and player starts combo again by the time the enemy reovers. downtime means nothing when you hit. only when you don't and OE has a higher downtime.

[RRyuugu]

You need 4 PB gauges constantly filled for each area of the map. With 4 players each area will be cleared so fast that PB gauges won't be built so often.

You're clearly trolling if for some reason you think that PB gauges are going to be full at the start of every area. With a decently equipped party, the times a PB gauge would be filled would be around 4 tops per player. And that's pushing it.

As for the fast mob dodging Over End. A fast mob can easily move out of Sword swing range. And what are the fast mobs in the game? Finjers and Akroses are the only ones that move around so much that Over End will miss even with target lock.

And those two mobs can't be properly hit with Sword swings.

[The_Pup]

No it adds to down time. You need to wait for the NPCs to move forward before engaging the enemy yourself.

That is down time you are not attacking while waiting for the enemies to target the NPCs.

How does paralyzing an enemy remove down time? Because it can't move away? That's a faulty assumption. It requires that the enemy is close enough to the player. If the Force paralyzes a Finjer you will still need to move towards it and still attack it. Down time still exists. It only partially removes the downtime of following the enemy around but you will still need to move towards the enemy and during that time you are not attacking.

And how are you assured that Rangers will use Stun? Celeb is the most popular element. As for Forces GiMegid+Magical Sign is a popular enough, a combination which is powerful enough to take a lot of enemies down on it's own without any help from a Sword user.

Have the NPC stay near the player. Not all enemies attack NPCs, but the ones that do are not attacking the player. And NPCs keep enemies engaged. They aren't entirely useless.

If the Force paralizes a finger, it reduces the catching up you have to do with OE and normal attacks.

Rangers can use stun, it's called Thriller Combo.

GM+MS is a similar concept except it combines techs and a PA. The GM+MS user wouldn't use the combination against single enemies, they'd stick to normal tech spam.

[RRyuugu]

NPCs cannot be controlled to stay near the player except with a constant stream of "Safety First" Commands.

Every time you're command your NPCs is a time you're not attacking. More down time. Also because of this wall of NPCs, enemies will be farther away from the player. Causing more down time.

Thriller combo? All Rangers use Thriller Combo? No they don't. It's 1 out of 3 PA's on 1 out of 7 Guntypes. Even those with a Handgun and Thriller Combo will not always be using the PA. And those that do use the PA aren't always assured of paralyzing a mob.

I've Forces spam GM+MS on single mobs. There's no assurance that a Force will spam Zonde. And even if the Force does spam Zonde most of them don't even need help to kill a mob. They can kill it themselves.

So getting the type of Ranger who will spam Thriller Combo or has a Stun Element on his gun or a Force who spams Zonde but isn't capable enough to kill the mob with it (which seriously is just unrealistic given how powerful a Tech Spam Force is on his own) This is your scenario for your formula? Stop joking, this involves a team you won't encounter all the time if at all.

Give it up, you can't even give one proper scenario in the game that supports this formula of yours. Over End spammers on the other hand don't really require a specific party, except maybe a Force for Level 11-15 Shifta, but that's a luxury. They don't even care where the enemy spawns. They don't need to dodge that much and don't even need invincibility from MAGs.