Expert mode requirement : Directory, help and Q&A

[Karen Erra]

its absolutely no excuse to be using any of those when they handed out (recently too) more Chronos, Amphridite and Lib materials for people to utilize. Those collection file weapons are not remotely good aside from aesthetics. Absolutely no reason to main them especially with how long it takes to make them, which in that time, a returning player can make a Stil series weapons which is the current power creep

You make it almost sound as if we compare 1* with 15* weapons here. Chaval and the likes may not be the best weapons around, but surely one is able to deal good damage with them.
While I agree that there is bad parties on expert (which had always been the case, probably since one month in every new requirement), because there is good and bad people everywhere, I don't think that you need Atra EX, Lightstream, Liberate to deal sufficient damage to hold your ground.
As a person who has several different characters I surely don't have an Atra EX, Lightstream or Liberate for all of them and rely on other weapons too and I think I'm doing just fine with a well affixed Chaval Wand or whatever.

why so non expert players can whine even more about "muh elitism"? you already saw what happened after the last Expert Req, with how easy the last one and how everyone else at the time jumped to the new one, the EQ's that went by (aka Easter XH at the time) that the EQ was too hard, that the hardcore audience ditched the casuals and actually complained to Sega about not having that carry. It was stated on a stream when it happened but thats something you can look for on bumped.

it's not remotely hard for people to learn their class properly, develop some skills and play the game at a good level. instead all the non expert players want to whine and moan about "expert too hard, its for elitist!"

Funny that you complain about people who can't or barely can do the expert requirement whining about it, yet you complain yourself an awful lot about just these people who are not as well equipped
as you are or have that same level of skill you have. I guess both sides complaining about each other is just how this will always go.
My point is that an overly stupid requirement, that only a small amount of people could actually reach, would take care of many problems. The high-class experts can play among themselves and the casual players can form the big rest of the playerbase. Maybe something like that is needed to get this everlasting conflict out of the way.
Whatever they add next as a requirement for expert matching, it will surely make everyone complain even more again.

Surely it's good if everyone just ups their gameplay and put more skill and effort into it, but regardless, there will always be good and bad people and there will always be good and bad runs. I say stop acting like it's the end of the world, if there is a few slower runs here and there, but I know you take it a lot more seriously than that, so ignore that I said it.

[the_importer_]

If SEGA really cared about an Expert mode, they would drop that title and make something like the following:

-Add Expert for each class in the training mode which requires good DPS and skill mastering in order to complete
-Each training would be different and accommodate each class to what's it's suppose to be good at
-Re-tune these every time there's a new level cap or new way of playing and/or affixing
-Refuse entry to expert games if the main and sub classed aren't capped and if the main class has not passed the latest expert requirements

[ArcaneTechs]

Funny that you complain about people who can't or barely can do the expert requirement whining about it, yet you complain yourself an awful lot about just these people who are not as well equipped
as you are or have that same level of skill you have. I guess both sides complaining about each other is just how this will always go.
My point is that an overly stupid requirement, that only a small amount of people could actually reach, would take care of many problems. The high-class experts can play among themselves and the casual players can form the big rest of the playerbase. Maybe something like that is needed to get this everlasting conflict out of the way.
Whatever they add next as a requirement for expert matching, it will surely make everyone complain even more again.

non expert vs expert will always be a double edged blade, like you said, both sides will have something to complain about

Surely it's good if everyone just ups their gameplay and put more skill and effort into it, but regardless, there will always be good and bad people and there will always be good and bad runs. I say stop acting like it's the end of the world, if there is a few slower runs here and there, but I know you take it a lot more seriously than that, so ignore that I said it.

im not acting like its the end of the world though, Im too lazy to go look at my posts but im not over exaggerating like Zulastar about randoms as of late because I just all around stopped caring but I'm always going to hold a certain level of play that people who play this game on the daily and go through all the power creep (expert req, clearing content over and over etc) should have some sort of increased level of knowledge about how things work and improve from there or at the very least, plateau at a good level of play if they're going to be lazy.

few slower runs in Easter UH for example is kinda frustrating, most of us want that S8 Shifta for personal use or for a quick meseta, the more runs the better (average 4-5, maybe 6 if your group is super good) but the whole casual "just for fun" attitude isn't going to get me those runs but it'll definitely net those people 10mins per chance at that capsule.

[Zulastar]

few slower runs in Easter UH

If it was like that, but there's difference between 7-8 minutes an 10-12 when even 4th run is impossible.
I had 12 minutes run just yesterday and really tired of people like some Ranger there just holding modified Parallel Slider button through all map and don't even bother to put WB on.

[ralf542]

its absolutely no excuse to be using any of those when they handed out (recently too) more Chronos, Amphridite and Lib materials for people to utilize.

Your units are super budget friendly which at this point, you can re-affix them with something better but I've suggested in the past,

The easy stones that they handed out are 4 Chronos and 2 Amphitrite, but some people arent a hardcore elite raiders and missed them all.

Those units are so budget friendly, that they are the default affixes.

[ArcaneTechs]

If it was like that, but there's difference between 7-8 minutes an 10-12 when even 4th run is impossible.
I had 12 minutes run just yesterday and really tired of people like some Ranger there just holding modified Parallel Slider button through all map and don't even bother to put WB on.

ok what do you expect anyone to do? I'm ending up in some 10min runs myself but overall end up with at least 4 runs done, its annoying but you can't do much about it aside not starting the EQ late. It's a gamble everytime when you're playing with rando's, either suck it up or go join a team and run with them for a higher quality mpa. Nothing else you can do

The easy stones that they handed out are 4 Chronos and 2 Amphitrite, but some people arent a hardcore elite raiders and missed them all.

Those units are so budget friendly, that they are the default affixes.

a lot of the stones in the past required you to just log on or run a set amount of EQs, you don't even need to be hardcore for that and you even get one of each stone/key just by running DQ over and over. While boring, it's low effort and you're working on Stil series while doing it

[otakun]

I find it funny that some people think getting 100+ people to play the way you want is easier than getting 12 people who share your opinion to do runs ... How about getting Sega to design a system that makes premade MPAs easier to do rather than just keep moving a bar every other year.

[ArcaneTechs]

I find it funny that some people think getting 100+ people to play the way you want is easier than getting 12 people who share your opinion to do runs ... How about getting Sega to design a system that makes premade MPAs easier to do rather than just keep moving a bar every other year.

see that requires effort on Sega's part, whether they do it or not people will still be mad. now this isn't only my opinion about more runs the better, play meta classes etc a lot of people have this mind set, not just my loud mouth here and others on psow. its a thing believe it or not just obvious they run it as teams instead or coordinated friend groups both Eng and JP

[Dark Mits]

I find it funny that some people think getting 100+ people to play the way you want is easier than getting 12 people who share your opinion to do runs ... How about getting Sega to design a system that makes premade MPAs easier to do rather than just keep moving a bar every other year.

The options we are given when opening a room were supposed to do that (Serious, Laid-back, the other 2 options which I forget what they are), as well as the options given when dropping a party maker (for exp, for rare items, for bosses, and I again forget the 4th option). But these cannot work when they are simply indicators and do not influence who you end up with when opening a room. At the same time, if mpa forming was "locked" according to these preferences, then everyone would flock to the option with the lowest waiting time.

Also, how does one design an automatic group formation system for a PvE game, when even games with skill-measuring systems that have hard math behind them (LoL, Dota 2, Overwatch, and generally any PvP-focused game) have massive complaints about group-forming being broken?

Regarding finding others who play the way you want, that's the entire purpose of Teams. Teams are not just the Tree ATK buff. They're supposed to be communities of people who have common goals or interests. If the Team does not meet your standards, then you move on until you find one you are comfortable with. Also, we have Group chat for the exact same reason, another way to form mini-communities that are not tied to Teams.

[otakun]

see that requires effort on Sega's part, whether they do it or not people will still be mad. now this isn't only my opinion about more runs the better, play meta classes etc a lot of people have this mind set, not just my loud mouth here and others on psow. its a thing believe it or not just obvious they run it as teams instead or coordinated friend groups both Eng and JP

I dont mind people preferring the idea of people playing meta builds with decent gear. I am speaking more of the fact that expecting everyone to play the way you expect or want isn't something you should. For example of Easter UH, if you want people going in with their mains for quicker runs, don't go randoms with people who could just be doing bingos on their weeklies characters (like I have). Though on a final note, while I am aware of Sega being lazy with some convenience updates, pretty sure just making something easier to do would be better for the playerbase. Like making affixing easier (cheaper) would make people who spend billions on gear mad but then you would have higher stated people on more runs (except bingo runs =P)

The options we are given when opening a room were supposed to do that (Serious, Laid-back, the other 2 options which I forget what they are), as well as the options given when dropping a party maker (for exp, for rare items, for bosses, and I again forget the 4th option). But these cannot work when they are simply indicators and do not influence who you end up with when opening a room. At the same time, if mpa forming was "locked" according to these preferences, then everyone would flock to the option with the lowest waiting time.

Also, how does one design an automatic group formation system for a PvE game, when even games with skill-measuring systems that have hard math behind them (LoL, Dota 2, Overwatch, and generally any PvP-focused game) have massive complaints about group-forming being broken?

Regarding finding others who play the way you want, that's the entire purpose of Teams. Teams are not just the Tree ATK buff. They're supposed to be communities of people who have common goals or interests. If the Team does not meet your standards, then you move on until you find one you are comfortable with. Also, we have Group chat for the exact same reason, another way to form mini-communities that are not tied to Teams.

well, I was speaking more for a system where you can assign an MPA to one leader that starts runs to make them quicker as an example. I'm already aware of the systems you are speaking of but clearly they aren't enough for the people who are complaining about expert.