cast guntechers.... ur thoughts

[shakowski]

im trying to be a cast fortegunner/guntecher and right now im working on the guntecher side. i just want to know, am i wasting my time. can casts complete the guntecher role successfully

[JAFO22000]

Yes. You'll be way more "Gun" than "Techer" though. Your resta will be mighty weak and forget about trying to use attack techs, but you will be able to buff yourself and heal yourself fully (after 3-4 casts of resta ).

You'll probably find yourself going back to Fortegunner though, because you'll basically be doing the same thing as a GT that you do as a FG except your stats will be much lower. You will be able to use resta and buffs, but this really doesn't help out that much.

I feel humans or neumans are better choices for guntecher as their added TP makes the "techer" part actually useful.

[Sychosis]

Newman TP and "-techer" racial bonuses DO NOT make the techer part viable. AT ALL.

Yak Banga on fire enemies > Rabarta on fire enemies.

At best, attacks techs are useful against bullet resistant enemies. Of course, DoT SEs are far superior than techs in this case as well.

Really, CAST/Human are the top 2 best choices. Then Beast and Newman are tied for 3rd.

[Akaimizu]

Actually, I don't quite agree. While Newman get a little less HP, they make up for it by the way I've seen them survice techs (from the growing up portion). Maybe you've seen different, but the little HP advantage the Humans get plus that 7 or so extra late game DFP does little to nothing in surviving against monster attacks, the way they are in this game.

Better Resta, an MST advantage of over 100+, the boost of evade, and the ATA advantage are a big plus for the Newman over the Human, in this case.

Now maybe it's different for male humans than female ones, but as a human female, you're pretty much frail like a newman but missing all those newman bonuses. The ATP advantage is small and adds very little difference in numbers. The one small advantage is those few lucky cases where a physical attack might kill the newman while putting the human in the red, but towards the late game, a GT of human or newman position dies in 1 or 2 hits anyway.

Also remember that most Bullet resistant enemies resist your Bullet SEs 95% of the time, so if you want to deal with them faster you are forced to a Bow (and of course, using traps).

It's from my personal experience that Human and Newman are at least tied in the GT. And quite often, more slighted towards the Newman. For both of them it is either dodge or die, and the main thing (lategame) that saves me upon impact is Evade. Something a Newman does just as well, as a Guntecher.

Side by side 80/10 stats, both female:

Stat | Newman | Human
----------------------
HP | 1547 | 1655
ATP | 472 | 530
ATA | 453 | 420
TP | 393 | 338
DFP | 98 | 106
EVP | 352 | 352
MST | 266 | 168
STA | 14 | 14

GTs don't live off of direct damage, they deliver it in SEs; But when you quickly add in the natural ATP given by a weapon, the ATP difference barely shaves off a difference of 10 HP. The later the game, the lower that difference makes.

The ATA isn't huge, though it's a flip/flop. More numbers in this mean less 0s and better statistical SE chances. TP, I basically use a slot to help bring myself up to the advantage Newman get naturally.

DFP at those numbers might make the physical damage differ by a couple of points. The MST is a much larger difference and oftentimes where I see the Newman take a tech where I can't.

The difference in HP is about 100. Monsters in this game, typically don't hit for something in that difference. It's usually around 1200, maybe 1400 (between one or two attacks), but then it's automatically 1700 or 2000+. Techs, on the other hand, typically kill the human first with that difference. There's very little cases, that happen very rarely, in which they hit in that same-equipped human survive/newman don't category; and only for physical ones.

Anyway, just a description of how something looks on paper and exactly what one sees in-game, that puts those numbers into perspective. Something I told people I would take the time to do.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2007-06-28 10:23 ]</font>

[JAFO22000]

Oh, the GT attack techs are no good regardless. When I mentioned Newman or Human being the better choice, I was thinking of the added TP for resta. Cast GT resta is so pathetic, they're really better off going FG and palletizing dimates. Low TP not only affects the actual tech, but also the choice of wand you can equip.

Low TP + a crappy wand = I should've stayed a Fortegunner.

[chibiLegolas]

The urge to go FoG will be strong for a cast. But the main differences on why you'd want to stick to GT depends on your playstyle.
GT's are designed solely for support purposes by applying SE through guns. Debuffing (since a lot of other casters don't debuff anyways). And emergency resta.

You'd also have access to long bows and fans. Both of these level quicker than guns, so they're less painful to use. And fans would be used primary for damage cause of their high elemental % and 3 concentrated shots to 1 enemy.

WIth my caseal 80/10 using a grinded 6* wand + TP buff, I'd heal somewhere 400-550 per cast. I can't remember exactly how much. Perhaps other caseals have a better figure. But our resta's are basically emergency heals. A quick cast to buy team mates time to pop in a mate themselves. Though I can heal up a FO pretty well with 1 casting. And often enough, I feel like my resta's more of a support for my FO in the party. But it's good enough to get teammates out of the yellow. Though it's annoying to see teammates get lazy. See that I'm using resta and they assume I'll heal them to full. IMO, it's a waste of time to stand there for 2+ castings of resta when they could easily pop a dimate to heal the rest themselves.

On the other hand, reverser's pleny helpful. I've forgotten if our reverser's strong enough or not to remove the debuff from worms on S and S2.

A more complete GT info would be found in the guide tho. So you might want to look in there.
http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.p...022&forum=22&3



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: chibiLegolas on 2007-06-28 10:09 ]</font>


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: chibiLegolas on 2007-06-28 10:12 ]</font>

[Sychosis]

I find pretty much all the stat bonuses between Human and Newman to be negligible. The extra TP gives what? 11 more HP per resta? Its real value comes in using wands a level sooner than a human (if that). HP and MST cancel out for the most part (HP even might become much more valuable if ST does indeed nerf armor %s), EVP doesn't matter for the most part seeing as you shouldn't be taking too many hits to begin with, and cancels out with DFP's helping against physical blows and helping you use armors a level or 2 sooner than a Newman.

Really, it boils down to ATP vs ATA. ATP works better for cards, xbows, shotguns and such where the difference is magnified per bullet. ATA gets you couple less 0s per enemy.

That said, better armor earlier + HP + ATP for multi bullet weapons is better IMO. Which is why CAST trumps them all from what I see.

[Akaimizu]

Yeah, Casts do gain that advantage. I do agree with you, on that one. I, for one, did mention that in some ways I think SEGA miscalculated that one and gave a little too much advantage to a race that wasn't *on paper* expected to excel at that hybrid class as much. If only that little extra ATP really did something, in the Human's case, that would be a Human Advantage; but in reality the difference is so small, you might as well group the Human with the Newman together (a couple of extra HP damage difference on a class already not known for their direct DPS). In most cases, they're hurting the monster just as much, and still want those SEs to pick up the slack (when that isn't enough).

On the other hand, at least I can say my Resta has been helpful in parties. It's nothing on Fortetecher, or if I somehow get that rare Tech Charge booster; but it's good enough for certain emergency heals.

The TP boost is actually quite a bit more than 11 HP better resta. It's pretty significant, for emergency heals. It's one of the reasons why I actually bought that TP booster unit and put it on. It brings my TP up to where the natural Newman would have it.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2007-06-28 10:33 ]</font>

[akratic]

My level 80 male cast is maxed out GT and fG.

My resta is so weak that I often use stars instead of using resta to help out my teammates. It's faster and helps them A LOT more.

[Hrith]

Cast GT quite fails outside soloing, but even then, human is better.

If you're better off using Star Atomizers, you'd be even better off staying Fortegunner.

It's a good idea to level up GT for soloing tough missions, I suppose, although soloing as Fortegunner is much faster (with Partner Machine and Maya Shidow).