Assuming an MPA consisting of 12 people whose DPS is identical, including at least one caster class, the most efficient thing that caster can do is spam Zanverse during bosses. Unless someone else already is, of course.
Assuming an MPA consisting of 12 people whose DPS is identical, including at least one caster class, the most efficient thing that caster can do is spam Zanverse during bosses. Unless someone else already is, of course.
Originally Posted by GHNeko
Maenara - Level 75 HU/FI/RA/GU/FO/TE/BR/BO
I'd like to hope that if multiple players are spamming Zanverse, the one with the highest damage multiplier takes effect, but probably not.
I'm sorry, I'm not a scrub, I don't share your mentality. I don't think that one weapon is sufficient for any aspect of gameplay. Do you ever watch TA videos or anything else like that? Using multiple weapons is being efficient. Equipping yourself with baseline requirements of just one weapon in UQs, even if you're a Gunner or a Braver, is no better than running around with 9*s in SH TD3. Gunner can make perfectly adequate use of assault rifles, gunslashes, partisans, and launchers, and should do so. Katana Bravers can make perfectly adequate use of partisans and wired lances and should do so. Bow Bravers can make perfectly adequate use of assault rifles, launchers, and gunslashes, and should do so. Saying otherwise is not spouting BS, it is stating facts about playing efficiently. You have options. Suggesting that you can play as efficiently as possible with just one weapon is spouting BS.
The fact that no content required multiple weapons is irrelevant when considering that multiple weapons has always been the standard for efficient play. Even in VH, every class that subbed Hunter had excellent partisan usage, even Fo/Hu was a thing for TAs because of this, so it's not like this is a strange, new phenomenon. If you were playing efficiently, you would have no issue with this handicap. Since you didn't do so beforehand, you're paying the price for it. Don't think Anga's worth getting another weapon to fight against? Don't think this is good game design? Too bad, this content is supposed to cater to efficient players that would have no trouble bypassing Anga's resistances. In thinking one weapon should always be sufficient, you are handicapping yourself and everyone you play with. The handicap was always there, it just never meant enough before.
Even if Anga was the sole maker of the trend of using multiple weapons, it should be evident that you're supposed to get multiple weapons to fight it instead of bitching about how you can't rely on one weapon anymore and claiming Anga isn't worth the trouble of getting another weapon. If you really feel that way, get the hell out of UQs. You're a liability taking up a spot a better player can take.
Last edited by LonelyGaruga; Dec 9, 2014 at 01:27 PM.
I thought almost every melee with HU sub liked using multiclass partisans, at the least.
I'll repeat again that in an MPA, you can switch to taking care of the mobs if you really don't have any other weapon options.
You'd be surprised at how big of an assumption that is.
Let's take a worst case scenario, caster does nothing but use Zanverse and otherwise deals x damage. An example would be having to use multiple Zanverses to cover the MPA:
x+P <= P(1+Z)
Where x is caster's damage, P is rest of MPA's damage, and Z is contribution from zanverse.
If there's no other modifiers to Zanverse, then:
Z=20% (base power) * 85% (Anda's resistance) = 17%
x+P <= P + 17%*P
x <= 17%*P
That'd be over twice the amount you'd expect from identically distributed damage, buuut if you're able to single-handedly cause Agna to resist light, you're probably doing more than that.
I don't know about this part; they have the option, and some of those get discussion in the Gunner thread, but that doesn't necessarily make it a great option. A lot of those options definitely seem like they'd be in a similar range as a tech class being force to use a non-mastery element. Probably a bit worse since so little from the GU skill tree could apply.
Last edited by Walkure; Dec 9, 2014 at 06:37 PM.
I bet you never brought a gun to Caves or Dark Falz form 3, either.
I wouldn't really know, I think the Hunter and Ranger subclasses can make up for this somewhat. Gu/Hu partisan usage seems pretty solid, and IIRC assault rifles are the best option for a number of things regardless of subclass (Satellite Cannon's hard to beat). At the very least, it's better than sticking with a resisted weapon to fight Anga, and there's always mopping up mobs like you mentioned. Though a Gu/Ra should probably stick to WBing Anga before prioritizing mobs.
Main point is just that they aren't made useless by Anga resisting TMGs. While I made a point that Force has it pretty rough if their main elements get resisted, I would never say that they're useless, unlike SOME posts here with certain other classes.
The viability of partizan as a gunner is kind of a stretch in my opinion. It just wouldn't do very good damage outside of chain, especially if you're affixed for r-atk. One shotting trash in SH, fine, but in XH and UQ it's kind of useless. Rifles and launchers have their uses if you sub ranger, not too sure about gunslash over TMG PAs. Launcher is specifically useful for killing Kartagots from the front, and possibly better than TMG in some mobbing situations. ZRA Cosmos Breaker and Rodeo Drive is also kind of cool.
While I do agree that using multiple weapons is more efficient than using only one, I would say that there's certainly an issue of running out of weapon palettes to use them all. It's a legitimate reason to stick to only one depending on your preferred playstyle. Using sword without dedicating all 6 palettes to sword PAs is pretty limiting, so you're really not able to fit in more slots for Assault Buster, Holding Current, and maybe Kaiser Rise or Wild Round just to build gear for HC. Not that sword is a weapon that should even be mentioned when talking about efficiency, but it's not like a FI/HU or HU/FI can use most weapons in their arsenal all at once and have access to every single PA each weapon can use at will anyway. I shouldn't even have to go into how bad the combo system is in limiting your weapon/PA selection.
Personally I've never understood the notion that one plays a "Twin Dagger user" or a "Double Saber user", and refuses to use anything else. I can understand using your favourite weapon when it works, regardless of it being the most efficient or not, but people will just not use anything else, even if that weapon sucks for certain situations. . _.
I like to play classes to their maximum potential though, rather than pigeonholing myself into certain aspects of a class. People complain about PSO2 just being about using the same attacks over and over again, but the most efficient way to play is to use lots of different attacks in different situations, and people seem to overlook that because it's hard or something, and needs more investment than just using one thing over and over again.
I mean, there's uses for Bow as Braver (bursts, Tower Defense assistance from your lane in premade MPAs), Jet Boots as Force (shortcutting, step, dodging out of dangerous Zondeels, Razonde becomes effective), and things like that, but unless you're using something 90% of the time, people just won't look into it.
EDIT: Yes, the combo system really needs to be reworked. Anything with a shift action uses that awful limiting system. They should really implement it like Nova: Shift actions are actually placed on the palette much like PAs, so all weapons use the same palette system as Rifles, etc.
as far as i'm concerned, i like efficient play and variety and i've been playing Fi/Hu for the longest time so i'm good on alternatives
but still i don't like the implementation of this 'imunity' system
i look at it this way, if i'm Braver and i can't use katana, i might as well play Fi. If i'm gunner and i can't use TMGs, again, i might as well play Ra or Fi
for some classes, the alternatives just make you feel like a knock-off while some others don't have this problem
hi
Letting Hu be shorthand for combined multipliers on a Hu sub. According to Walkure's PA stats:
Outside of Katana Combat, a Br/Hu using Hatou 16* would do 1408 Pow/sec with a 1.15 x 1.1 x 1.1 x Hu multiplier = 1959Hu Pow/sec.
Outside of Chain Trigger, a Gu/Hu using Volg-Slide End-Throw at 16 would do 1690 Pow/sec with a 1.2 x 1.1 Average High Time x Hu multiplier = 2230Hu Pow/sec.
*Using 16 because there was no data on Volg-Slide End-Throw at 17.
So an SATK-affixed Gunner like Maenara's build could theoretically do more DPS with a Partisan than a Br/Hu outside of Katana Combat. And while the Br/Hu would have higher DPS during Katana Combat, the Gu/Hu has Chain Trigger.
I dunno, I think SATK Gunner is pretty viable unless Katana Braver somehow isn't viable.
Last edited by Selphea; Dec 9, 2014 at 09:14 PM.
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