Gunner Stuff Discussion ™

[Moffen]

Is anyone else moving onto Gunner/Fighter with the introduction of the 30hp per hit lifesteal S-class ability? If so,how are you holding up in the dragon raid? I'm really enjoying testing out the class combination now that i have a sustainable way of maintaining perfect keeper outside a rainbow set of fornis but i havent affixed my Atra TMG properly so i havent taken it into the raid yet.
Playing around with my qliphad tmgs and the damage output is ridiculously good,especially on mobs.
Not having to do an animation to swap stances and the stance swap being on one button is a blessing @_@

Would love to hear some experienced input.

[TheIrregular]

I already die enough with Gu/Hu, Gu/Fi is out of question.

[Zephyrion]

Is anyone else moving onto Gunner/Fighter with the introduction of the 30hp per hit lifesteal S-class ability? If so,how are you holding up in the dragon raid? I'm really enjoying testing out the class combination now that i have a sustainable way of maintaining perfect keeper outside a rainbow set of fornis but i havent affixed my Atra TMG properly so i havent taken it into the raid yet.
Playing around with my qliphad tmgs and the damage output is ridiculously good,especially on mobs.
Not having to do an animation to swap stances and the stance swap being on one button is a blessing @_@

Would love to hear some experienced input.

I've been flexing between GU/HU and GU/FI depending on content for a good year now. GU/FI is kinda finnicky and pretty much requires Fornis or Atra with GS S4, on top of contraptions like HP Restorate and HP recovery mag builds, but it can work in pretty much any content that doesn't put too much pressure on your HP (stuff like UQ is out of question pretty much). My Deus solo was made with GU/FI so I can safely say tight play can kind of make up for its squishiness.

I also tried on Dragon, and while it's definitely one of the hardest raid for HP upkeep as far as GU goes, it's honestly not too terrible provided you can use Fornis. You also do get some really good mileage out of wise stance for back legs so that's a nice plus.

[escarlata]

Been playing Gu/Fi for a while when TMG stance ring was first a thing, and fell back to /Hu shortly after. /Fi is nice and all with its TAJA combos, it feels like TMG is more of a short-burst class rather a prolonged-combo class, which means that the slight advantage TAJA provides usually just evens out against /Hu bonuses in the long run (with the trade-off of stable/consistent dmg and survival). Would have been great if sroll kept TAJA but the fact that it doesn't is my biggest gripe with the fluidity of the class (part of why I still main knuckle over DS/TD on my Fi/Hu). I sometimes just run TAJAPPS ring on my Gu/Hu and feel like I'm not missing out much damage-wise from Gu/Fi.

[GoldenFalcon]

Gunner seems like it makes really good use of TAJA (Approach->Infinity0->SatAim, Grim/Aerial->Reverse->Period) but I've probably decided on doing Gu/Hu anyway since enemies will end up facing the wrong way, PP Slayer sucks with Chain Trigger, SRoll ruins TAJA like you said, and Gu/Hu can use the Ranged Critical ring (I probably won't use TAJAPP or Weak PP Restore)

[Zephyrion]

You guys don't seem to have touched GU/FI recently. While it's true in most drawn fights its damage output will fall in line with GU/HU (since we're humans and fuck up), there are a few points worth noting

-Positional stance issue is not much of a thing anymore. You have more than enough points to dual stance, stance not having animation anymore means you can freely change from one to the other during whatever, and now the stance minimum damage is much higher than it used to be, meaning you don't lose much from getting one or two hits with the wrong stance

-TAJA sees most of its mileage in chain finisher than anything, as it both gives you a lot of upkeep before your next chain and tacks additional damage where it needs to be. It is more a liability than anything outside of chain, so you'd preferably keep GU/FI for content where chain management is good (like Mother or most raid bosses)

-Any raid where Wise Stance is reliably applicable significantly boosts the power of GU/FI. While I reckon Elder is irrelevant to say the least, Dragon actually is a great place to GU/FI (provided you don't eat too much dirt)

I do agree both classes have their strengths and shortcomings, and that GU/HU is more stable and universal though, just felt I had to clarify on some specific points

[escarlata]

For refamiliarity (is that even a word) sake, I took GuFi for like 4 runs of solo PD. Definitely more fluid than before, but even so it feels really awkward when you are not in Wise Stance because Brave Stance is that much weaker than /Hu does without TAJA. In Brave (i.e. majority), while /Fi has a pretty strong TAJA Inf-0 combo, that's pretty much all it has over /Hu (considering its DA-SA loop is basically the same power as that of /Hu since the first DA misses TAJA), so it feels very lackluster whenever you don't have enough of a window to pull off the entire combo; and that you are giving up the flexibility for a slightly stronger Inf-0.

Honestly, my biggest gripe about /Fi is how clumsy TAJA is with High Time, which forces you to sroll a bit too often to keep TAJA going. If Gu/Fi can actually maintain TAJA consistently, I would be switching to /Fi without a second thought (MH and Automate are not even that significant tradeoffs in the first place because of how HT works anyway). A big part of what makes /Fi subs fun in the first place is really just TAJA (or for some people, for the sake of being different). That's why I just can't stand playing /Fi subs with a main class which literally has a skill that indirectly encourages you to break TAJA. (I mean, that knuxs' ability to maintain TAJA so easily is why I still main knux when pretty much every other FiHu is using DS/TD nowadays.)

[Moffen]

yeah,I started playing Gu/Fi more over the past few days since i made the post now that I have affixed Atra tmgs with HP steal,my only issue is my HP threshold as my RINA Arm is holding me back from having a comfortable amount of HP when I do my planned unit re-affix.
Dragon tends to double tick me for 600+ damage so its spooky to take into that fight but i manage to hold up in UQ pretty well.
I tried Reverse Tap/Infinite Fire on mobs I know I could group together pretty well and its pretty easy to wipe them out with a ton of damage faster than shift period.
I'll probably main this but I'd really like a Weila arm when it finally comes out so i can be comfy using it in content that hits like a truck.

doesnt Brave stance and all of hunters JA/Fury stance skills give the same multis now since they buffed brave a tiny bit?
Ive been looping DA/SA to keep TAJA up during loops and spamming is fine anyway since its the exact same damage as hu sub from the front ._.

[escarlata]

doesnt Brave stance and all of hunters JA/Fury stance skills give the same multis now since they buffed brave a tiny bit

Not really, not by a long shot. /Hu is 176% Strike, 161% Shoot, Brave by itself is 154% Front, 177% with TAJA.
In other words, DA-SA loops only break even from the 3rd PA onwards; and DA-Inf-0 loop only just breaks even if you complete the cycle. My problem is that Gu just cant seem to reliably get beyond the break-even point without losing HT.
If you plan on forsaking HT and just facetank everything tho, GuFi will draw ahead over GuHu for sure

[Moffen]

Alright,wanna give a shoutout to everyone who helped contribute to my question. Im juggling Gu/Hu and Gu/Fi depending on the content now that i know what works best where and that im comfortable using Fi sub now too.

On another note,are we getting another grim barrage update after this maint? I know i saw something about it a while back but i have no idea what we're actually getting since they already added omnidirectional travelling. Something about it popped up when compound seperate cooldowns were mentioned though.