Planned Adjustments -- EQs, Special Blocks, and Solo XQ

[Starryeyedbunny]

First link had a space in url which was fixed. I would like to point out that I was responding to guy who honestly believes S rank is impossible without Force on top of several other things. I would like to point out the link didn't include any AIS deployment. I would also like to point out that it doesn't matter in TD4 besides muh ticking boosts.

And no don't just say in your previous post how Force is required and everyone has to be very good at AIS to stand a chance at S rank and then just ignore a video that only used wands and 1 guy had Force sub, on top of not having used AIS. Words mean things and melee only can do fine in any TD if you have competent people.

And no your whole argument was that having (list of requirements) in TD4 is required for S rank. I called Force players shit several times precisely with you in mind since if you need all of that to S rank one EQ you are pretty shit and I would honestly have melee only block rather than play with your kind of Force.

You proved me wrong by proving my original point was right? Yeah, you proved that you can win without forces, by showing me a video of weaker forces S ranking. Ok? That shows your original insane idea of a strike only block without Br or Bo being a good idea as something insane.

And yeah, while I would want you on your melee only block where you think you honestly carry the whole TD with terrible strategies that you demonstrated would be locked into all the failing TDs, I think the original point stands against your skewed ideals.

And that's the whole point of my argument. And my reference to you later is pointing out the irony that you call the people out who are letting you win just like Vatallus mentioned. You have this screwed up idea that because the MPA won, you did great. Meanwhile, I fact check. I had parser up when I was TDing and I also am willing to admit faults. I try to avoid engaging in "Epic AIS vs Exoda AIS BATTULS" because I know player AIS are not supposed to do that, but rather go after towers, then mooks, then bosses. Only time they should ever attack an exoda is to laser one/two from using their laser on a tower.

Like I said, if you want your melee only blocks, go on Vita. See how well it goes.

Edit: Also that nicovideo demonstration is sketchy if it starts at wave 5... it doesn't help wave 5 and 6 are very boss heavy where holding current would let them go to town... I would also like to note these are organized groups as well. Like, don't get me wrong, I'm impressed they even did that, but it's...still off.

It makes me realize I need to work harder on forming my own team ._.;

[Daku]

If you referring to me, I was referring to PUG runs... where at least half the players as parser has revealed are bad and even if they ran something "OP" would perform considerable poorly compared to Pre-made MPA where you may not necessarily 'need' a Force, but in a pug, I'm sure as hell gonna go into TD4 as a Fo/Te with gear far above what should be need to pick up the slack, call me and other Forces 'shit' all you will but part of winning is really just realizing whats OP and using it while the scrubs are often the one deriding over such a choice. Kinda funny.

Since I don't have enough friends/team members for a full MPA I often look at things from the perspective of a PUG player, where a Force and good AIS usage are essentially needed because you need to carry some slack, which a Fo/Te's pure ability to mob and kill two Exoda back to back without taking so much as a breathe is far appreciated, I'm not saying we carry the entire TD... but my best TD4 run to date has been when I was and 3 friends queued into a MPA all as Force and had a strat where all of us where somewhat close to a tower to intercept any mooks, compound is also arguably one of the best things to stun apprentice with since it may as well have a 100% burn rate.

Also that techer only MPA was an organized group, of course it's gonna pass well, all the players likely had great gear for one... a huge thing over a pug where a force in any TD4 could have a 20 wind rod at +0 for all you know. If that techer MPA was a pug by some chance, at least 8 of them would lack the firepower to do anything.

I'm not even trying to say force carries the MPA or anything since variety is important, but a tech only MPA has a huge edge over a 'melee' only MPA

[TyroneSama]

I feel like I'm the only person who thinks TD3 is harder than TD4 in pugs. At least the TD4 map is fairly small, so you can put the MPA on your back and do everything if you have to. In TD3, if people don't spread correctly or aren't aware, expect to be doing a lot of running.

[Starryeyedbunny]

I'm not even trying to say force carries the MPA or anything snce variety is important, but a tech only MPA has a huge edge over a 'melee' only MPA

Really, anything that can pretty much speed their way to a tower is gonna have a huge advantage as well, with Ilzonde and Gurren taking the lead. Something that tech users(including Bo) and Br have. Being able to snipe from a distance is also a clear advantage as well. I've killed an exoda and miraculously (with some help, mind you) stopped two other exodas from firing thanks to a combo of ragrants and ilgrants. If I didn't pile in the damage myself, anyone helping wouldn't of been able to finish the job before the laser went off.

Though, this has horribly gone off topic lol

I feel like I'm the only person who thinks TD3 is harder than TD4 in pugs. At least the TD4 map is fairly small, so you can put the MPA on your back and do everything if you have to. In TD3, if people don't spread correctly or aren't aware, expect to be doing a lot of running.

Actually, I agree 100%. The only difference is TD4 has better rewards and is scheduled, so it's bound to come up more often in conversation.

[vantpers]

I like how you avoid the issues of Force not being needed by calling Te/Hu and Te/Br weaker Fo. I like how you completely forget you have just spouted shit like needing good AIS to even S rank on top of those Forces while the video didn't contain any AIS. And I LOVE how you ignore the video with S rank done by Wired Lance only users that are actually worse off than you would be in melee only block since they have no Fi/Hu's or don't use other Hunter weapons.

And no sorry I don't think you can talk about skewed ideas when I go to Vita blocks with all that melee and people playing on 15 FPS with 300 pixel screens and pull S rank barely while topping the scoreboard, and you are only able to get S rank by being carried by 4 other Forces as you've said.

The nico video is just second half as demonstrated, go look for the first part because honestly niconico douga is awful. And no backpedaling with things like "organized groups". You have applied your requirements to all TD4 runs and those guys aren't playing with just melee, they are playing without AIS.

[Starryeyedbunny]

Didn't I just said you proved me wrong about the point though?

You proved me wrong by proving my original point was right? Yeah, you proved that you can win without forces, by showing me a video of weaker forces S ranking. Ok? That shows your original insane idea of a strike only block without Br or Bo being a good idea as something insane.

Yeah...

Also I didn't ignore the video... I even commented on watching it. Hell, I even said I was impressed by what they did, even if it's shaddy for starting at wave 5.

Again, you're...kind of missing the point...where the original subject lays.

And backpedaling I'm pretty sure has to deal with going away from the subject in conversation... Which doesn't apply when I mention organized MPAs. When you take, again, extreme examples, it doesn't apply broadly. As Daku already mentioned, it's huge difference between a bunch of people who have really great gear and have things planned out compared to pugs and even team MPAs.

To this extent, the fact you don't want to go back to the original point because you know you were proven wrong and instead going on about something that you proved right that I even admitted to being wrong about...despite that being me stupidly saying "required" like people would get the idea that I'm stressing the point rather than actually meaning it's impossible without... That's just dodging the matter at hand.

[Daku]

Except there is a clear cut difference between an organized group doing challeneges and a random MPA of 12 people who may not even know each other. The only reason you don't want me 'backpedaling' into it is because you damn well know this, this is why some players join team like Night Arks and other teams running them consistently, pretty much a guaranteed S ranks imply because all 12 players know what to do, they will know where to be and have the gear to stand against a pack of goldrahda on their own if they need to do so.

A organized MPA is made by someone with the intent to complete a challenge or to complete X as fast as possible to preserve boost time and ensure a S rank, of course a Fo/Te isn't quite as needed, Although a MPA will probably still try to push one so they can fomelgion apprentice into submission so all the AIS can feed it many photon blasters at once.

This is behavior you never see in a pug instance at all, my points of a Pure anything that happens to be a pug will need slack carried and a block that only allowed melee would just be a glorified pug that happens to have only melee but you'd see +0 weapons abound and ungrinded units galore and it'd fail to be a S rank because of this... if you want a melee only MPA you can already make one and I'm sure it'll pass if you pick up well geared players who know their stuff to perform it, I'll just be sticking to what I know will net me my pledias/torana and not conforming to some random person on a forum who calls anyone not playing melee a bad player.

Dat scrub doe, seriously though I'll probably get a better conversation talking to a rock outside.

[Starryeyedbunny]

A organized MPA is made by someone with the intent to complete a challenge...

Pretty much a point to push...

I don't think people will find a "Force only run" as a challenge. I'm sure there's some videos of that out there, but that's hardly as impressive as a team of 12 wired lance users managing Wave 5 and 6. That's a test of skill, reaction, planning, and smarts. If I wanted to impress people, I sure as heck would do something like that myself. Hell, I've thought about soloing PD on Fo/Te myself, but that's also because it's one of the easier, if not the easiest(with some HP affixes at least lol) to clear solo. Where MPAs will have a safety net of moons if you fail by playing more aggressively, the thing that makes Fo/Te so good for Solo is that it can play aggressively, and well, play as it would in a MPA as well.

I'm not that amazing at the game to say, solo with Hu/Fi not abusing max IW or something.

[vantpers]

I don't quite get what you are wanting me to prove here. The whole thing began with dumbass opinion that you might as well give up TD4 without Fo/Te and Br/Hu. Then it was added that to S rank TD4 you require 4-5 Fo/Te some WB slave and really good AIS usage. Of course it was proven wrong with a simple video, and later backpedaled by saying that required didn't really mean required. Now you are saying what? That TD is easier by playing the most over powered class? Yes but you don't need if you play with players that aren't completely incompetent.Yes even if you aren't organized you can pull an S rank without any of the requirements mentioned besides maybe people knowing how to pilot AIS. You want me to find melee only run that just happened on a normal block randomly and someone was accidentally recording it?

[Tunga]

Vantpers you never fail dissapoint.